Only one of 887 problem “schoolgirls” did not have sex – Khir and UKM psychologist flayed

Most Female Students With Disciplinary Problems Admit To Having Sex

On Tuesday (27.2.07), the mainstrream media carried screaming headlines: “Shocking find in UKM study on female delinquents” (Star) and “Study: Troubled teens having sex” (New Straits Times) for the Bernama report “Most Female Students With Disciplinary Problems Admit To Having Sex”.

This is the Bernama report:

Most Female Students With Disciplinary Problems Admit To Having Sex
By Syed Azwan Syed Ali

KUALA LUMPUR, Feb 26 (Bernama) — A Universiti Kebangsaan Malaysia (UKM) study has revealed a shocking finding about high-risk female students with most admitting to have had sexual intercouse.

In the study conducted by UKM’s Children and Youth Psychology specialist Dr Khaidzir Ismail, all the 887 high-risk female students except for one confessed to have had experienced the “pleasure of the flesh”.

The three-month High-Risk Female Youth Profile Study which ended last December, had 20 students with disciplinary problems from each school, ranging from Form One to Form Five, as its respondents.

“It is sad and shocking to find all except one of the respondents admitted to having experienced sex. This is a painful finding but it is a reality that we have to accept,” he told Bernama at his office in Bangi, near here, today.

It is understood that the study was a state government initiative to deal with the deterioration of moral values among female youths in the state.

From the findings of the study, the state government aims to formulate a special training module to promote high moral values among girls.

Khaidzir said the study also found that the female students, aged between 15 and 16, were at a high risk of being involved in various disciplinary problems like trying to lose their virginity.

“The study also found that the problems committed by these students were due to external pressure like coming from broken homes where their parents were having difficulties in coping with life,” he said.

The study also revealed that apart from having sex, most of the respondents took drugs and were involved in pornography, secret societies, vandalism and truancy.

Khaidzir said most of these high-risk female students had low academic achievement and self-esteem, and poor communication skills, self-control and problem-solving capability.


The Selangor Mentri Besar, Datuk Seri Dr. Mohd Khir Toyo repudiated the UKM study, commissioned by the Selangor state government, the same day, calling it “rubbish”.

These developments have rightly provoked a very strong reaction and email from BPR, flaying Khir and condemning Dr. Khaidzir for violation of ethical code of conduct of a local psychologist, as follows:

Violation of ethical code of conduct by local psychologist

I am struck with horror at the recent headline in the Malay Mail Daily, detailing Selangor MB Khir Toyo’s outburst at the results of the High-Risk Female Youth Profile Study conducted by one Dr. Dr Khaidzir Ismail, who is reportedly a Child and Youth Psychology specialist at University Kebangsaan Malaysia (UKM).

This development is disturbing on several levels.

Firstly, Khir Toyo has no business ordering a research scientist to “correct” the data simply because it is an inconvenient fact for his administration. If the data acquisition methods and the data itself are problematic, they need to be peer-reviewed by others with expertise and competence in the field, and not by an unqualified ex-dentist who is overseeing what is perceived to be one of the most corrupt State administrations in the country.

Secondly, if what Khir Toyo says is correct based on his “investigation”, that the definition of sex in the survey was ambiguous, then it is very damaging to the competency of this UKM psychologist. One of the basic foundations of a psychologist is to have competent skills in measuring human behavior. There is no room for inflated and unnecessary ambiguity such as that described by Khir Toyo (assuming he is telling the truth).

The third and most DAMNING indictment on the competency of this UKM psychologist (without a reasonable doubt) is that he violated one of the basic tenets of human psychological research; i.e. by not ensuring the strictest confidentiality with regards to the private, identifiable information of those who participated in the study. Khir Toyo proudly trumpets the fact that his officials obtained the survey data, including personally identifiable information, and proceeded to make phone calls to a random selection of the study participants asking them if they indeed have had sex. This UKM psychologist is DUTY BOUND by ethical codes of conduct of the profession to ensure utmost confidentiality and has no business handing over private data to Khir Toyo’s goons to make phone calls with.

Dr. Khaidzir Ismail should be fired from UKM with immediate effect. In addition, if he is certified by any local or regional board for practicing psychology within the clinical setting, he should have his license immediately revoked before his lack of ethics and dismal professional conduct do serious damage to the physical or emotional well-being of those who put their trust in his professional capacity.

With half past six “professionals” like Dr. Khaidzir Ismail freely roaming around within the halls of Malaysian academia, it should hardly be surprising that local university rankings have been slipping down the tubes and are destined for a truly Malaysia Boleh record of someday being the first in the world…but at the back of the list.

Dr. Khaidzir is welcome to this blog to defend himself.

For convenience, the Malay Mail report “rubbishing” the UKM report is reproduce below:

It’s rubbish, says Khir

04 March, 2007

THE Universiti Kebangsaan Malaysia study is “rubbish”.

That was Selangor Menteri Besar Datuk Seri Dr Mohd Khir Toyo’s response to the study conducted by UKM’s Children and Youth Psychology specialist Dr Khaidzir Ismail which revealed that all the 887 respondents, except for one, confessed to have experienced the “pleasures of the flesh”.

“We have checked the findings and discovered that 68 per cent of its contents are lies. It’s rubbish.

“Khaidzir has admitted that the findings were inaccurate and flawed. I have spoken to him and told him to correct it,” said Dr Mohd Khir yesterday.

The Selangor Menteri Besar said he had gone through the survey findings thoroughly and spotted the inaccuracies.

“He got our population figures wrong and the definition of sex was flawed.

“On the question of sex … some people say touching with the mouth is sex and rubbing noses is also sex. See, even the definition of sex is not correct,” he said.

Dr Mohd Khir said he ordered his officers to pick at random the respondents who took part in Khaidzir’s survey.

“We picked 54 and called them up. They told our officers that they had never had sex and that they are virgins.

“Then how did the psychologist come to the conclusion that only one of the 887 girls interviewed was a virgin?”

The High-Risk Female Youth Profile study completed last December involved high-risk secondary students selected by their respective schools’ counsellors.

The three-month study revealed that 98 per cent of the respondents took drugs while 98 per cent were involved in secret societies, 96.8 per cent in gambling and 85.4 per cent in vandalism.

It also showed that 97.3 per cent had seen obscene materials and 77.2 per cent had skipped schools.

Dr Mohd Khir said the report had tarnished the State’s image.

“We are trying to be Number One and had hoped to lead the way and this happened,” he said.

He said the State Government had undertaken various measures to check the problem of indiscipline among students.

Dr Mohd Khir said the State Government had placed more than 100 troubled female youths under the supervision of the Selangor Wives Welfare and Charity Organisation (Balkis), Selangor Islamic Religious Council and Selangor Development Department.

  1. #1 by Libra2 on Sunday, 4 March 2007 - 12:27 pm

    Dr Mohd Khir: Hello, may I speak to Miss XXX, please.

    Miss XXX: Speaking.

    Dr Mohd Khir: I am checking on a study done by UKM.

    Miss XXX: What would you like to know?

    Dr Mohd Khir: Have you had sex before or are you still a virgin?

    Miss XXX: Stupid man!!! Which man would ask this type of
    question on the phone. And I don’t even know you.
    No, I never had sex and I am virgin. (Slams the
    Dr Mohd Khir: (soliloquising) “There you are. I know these girls are
    all virgins.”

    Perhaps Dr Khir can also call his civil servants and ask them this question, ” Hey there, are you corrupted “.

  2. #2 by osaya on Sunday, 4 March 2007 - 2:03 pm

    as a psychology postrgraduate myself, i strongly agree with the comments by BPR.

    although i suspect that Dr. Khaidzir may have been stuck between the devil and the deep blue sea (i.e. strong political pressure), ethics – especially those that deals with participants’ personal information – are the keystone to psychological research. without a participants’ trust that their anonymity will be protected, no decent data can be collected.

    this is a shameful and an outrageous act. period.

  3. #3 by Rocky on Sunday, 4 March 2007 - 2:06 pm

    This is crazy, calling up the people. They shuld fire the freaking guy. as for Khir Toyo, didn’t he declare Selangor a developed status based on a very subjective survey and wasn’t the survey sample smaller than in this case. So MB, semuanya ok mah. you boleh, orang lain pun boleh mah.

  4. #4 by sheriff singh on Sunday, 4 March 2007 - 2:12 pm

    Our researchers must be transparent about their methodologies. If this is weak, erroneous or inadequate, then the results would be unreliable. Like garbage in, garbage out.

    If Dr Khaidzair didn’t do a good job in his research, then he would be doing Malaysian researchers a disservice and giving them a bad name.

    In many western universities, ethics is very important and most of them have ethics committees to vet all proposed research. You have to get their OK before you proceed. The researcher’s behaviour is also considered. Breaching ethical codes in any profession is a very, very serious offence that get you disbarred, sacked, banned, struck off.

    If the good Dr had indeed breached ethical codes, then he should be sacked immediately and perhaps barred from any future research work. What will the world number 185 ranked (THES) university do about this case?

  5. #5 by palmdoc on Sunday, 4 March 2007 - 5:27 pm

    ““We picked 54 and called them up. They told our officers that they had never had sex and that they are virgins.”

    Are these people for real? Confidentiality breached and these officers now think the respondents will actually admit to having sex?
    Are they really so stupid or what?

  6. #6 by brt on Sunday, 4 March 2007 - 5:49 pm


    You’re right. He may have been stuck between the devil and the deep blue sea. And that was EXACTLY my point to Mr. Lim. The level of our academicians in Malaysia is so pathetic that they are nothing but spineless handpuppets and nodding donkeys to the political lords. The good ones with integrity like Dr. Azly Rahman, Dr. Gomez, Dr. Jomo, and countless others who can STAND UP to meddling have all left thanks to miscreants like Khir Toyo and their creation of an environment of mediocrity.

    This is actually a very serious offense by this Dr. Ismail and will do untold amount of damage to those doing good research, treatment programs, educational interventions, etc., in Malaysia.

    Actually this is a very good opportunity to light a fire under the bottoms of local academia. I hope Mr. Lim and those involved in professional bodies in Malaysia relevant to psychology and research in general, will take this Dr. Ismail and UKM to task. One only wonders what other types of unethical practices have tainted research coming out of Malaysian institutions.

    Wasn’t UKM also the same university where a goon squad of pro-govt students surrounded and harassed a bunch of innocent students? No surprises then. Trickle down stupidity is probably our local universities’ biggest accomplishment!

  7. #7 by Jin on Sunday, 4 March 2007 - 7:30 pm

    “Dr Mohd Khir said he ordered his officers to pick at random the respondents who took part in Khaidzir’s survey.”

    What is the respondent privacy here? How can their details given like this?

    Do you think the responsdents will answer honestly when they knew they were received the CALL from Menteri Besar office?

  8. #8 by WFH on Sunday, 4 March 2007 - 7:32 pm

    brt, the goon squad Uni was UPM, not UKM.

    I bet if Amir Muhammad were to produce another documentary based in Selangor and bankrolled by the Selangor State Govt, specifically by this Khir Toyo, he will definitely get past the censors this time around.

    Prospective movie title?
    “40 Year Old Virgin”

  9. #9 by izrafeil on Sunday, 4 March 2007 - 7:39 pm

    one begs the question, and if coin have two faces, what are the boys not involved? i mean are the boys all virgins?

  10. #10 by raven77 on Sunday, 4 March 2007 - 8:01 pm

    UKM Professors are basically the same as our khalwat squads…..obsessed with sex….Malaysians should forget about this pathetic lot and start focusing on private universities…….Can’t believe that despite he writing on the wall Malaysians still even read any of their cranky reports….

  11. #11 by Jeffrey on Sunday, 4 March 2007 - 9:12 pm

    The controversial UKM study by its psychology specialist, Dr Khaidzir Ismail, was on the behaviour of delinquent secondary schoolgirls. It was supposed to address the problem of moral decadence to help formulate a special training module to promote high moral values among youngsters/school girls.

    Judging by what happened after the revelations of the study findings, it looks like moral decadence of a different kind afflicts their elders who should know better.

    If one lesson may be drawn, it is that it is no point doing studies for the government whether Federal or State because the politicians are not interested in the truth. They are only interested in how the findings may further their political agenda or bolster their political and image. If the findings are not consistent with their political agenda or are not helpful to their political agenda, the findings are ‘rubbished’ no matter that they may be true.

    The case in point is the findings of Dr Lim Teck Ghee of ASLI’s Centre for Public Policy Studies (CPPS). When Dr Lim released his findings that bumiputera corporate share was estimated as high as 45% (which was higher than the official figure of 18.9 percent in 2004 underpinning the continuance of the NEP), his findings were repudiated by ASLI president, Mirzan Mahathir who relented to political pressure.

    The difference between Dr Lim and Dr Khaidzir is that Dr Lim stood by his findings and resigned.

    In the case of the latter, Dr Mohd Khir said, “Khaidzir has admitted that the findings were inaccurate and flawed. I have spoken to him and told him to correct it.” (Translated it means Dr Khir wants Dr Khaidzir to “correct” – which to me, it means ‘skew’ – the findings so as at least not to cast negative image to Dr Khir’s much touted developed status of Selangor). Politics is more important than truth. I regret that not only is Dr Khaidzir prepared to serve politics more than truth, but also has, as accused by BPR, “violated one of the basic tenets of human psychological research i.e. by not ensuring the strictest confidentiality with regards to the private, identifiable information of those who participated in the study” by providing their contact particulars to Dr Khir’s officers to contact 54 of the respondent interviewees, picked at random, for further questioning.

    The Selangor MB then sought to discredit the findings by saying Dr Khaidzir “got our population figures wrong and the definition of sex was flawed. On the question of sex … some people say touching with the mouth is sex and rubbing noses is also sex. See, even the definition of sex is not correct,” he said.

    Why is Dr Khir trying to discredit methodology and sampling by saying “in the first page he wrote 4.1 million, in second page 4.7 million” (which could have been typo error bearing no relevance) when as what Higher Education Minister Datuk Mustapa Mohamed said to reporters after launching the Public Higher Learning Institutions’ Expertise Directory, “the sample was provided by the state government to the researcher who had been asked to draw up a training module for problematic students”.

    (Here Mustapha is also trying to protect his political image from being dented by insinuations of an incompetent clinical psychologist in a tertiary institution like UKM under his portfolio who might not know how to adopt the right methodology and sampling for a study in relation to the answers it seeks to find).

    If Dr Khir questions the correctness of Dr Khaidzir’s methodology in the study, then it can equally be d that Khir’s methodology of having his officers ring the respondents up is even more unreliable. Of course, the girls would deny that they had sex by seeking to explain away that during the survey they thought “touching with mouth is sex and brushing noses is also sex” – they might be thinking that the State Officials were now contacting them to get them for illicit sex, Khalwat or something!

    The alternative is unthinkable – the imputation that UKM has a clinical psychologist who supposedly an expert in human behavior not making clear what was sex to the girls surveyed.

    Methodology and sampling are not the only problems besetting this study. It’s purpose and conception is as controversial.

    If the purpose is to address problems of moral decadence and delinquency amongst youngsters, why is the focus of the study as commissioned by the Selangor State government directed at girls only with great emphasis on sexual experience?

    When the State government provided the researchers with a sample of schools, and the school counsellors of these schools were asked to refer cases of female students with disciplinary problems for the study, what does Dr Khir really expect? These students were from broken homes. If they could flout normal school and larger society’s rules like taking drugs, involving in pornography, secret societies, vandalism and truancy, is it reasonable to expect they would abstain from having sex until they left school or preserve their virginity until marriage? What’s the shock?

    To the people in the State government, the sex part is the real shocker that is totally unacceptable. After all, we’re living in a cultural milieu that moral policing is fast becoming a norm. Here implicit is the assumption that females are the moral bulwark against sexual profligacy. Teenage boys no matter how sexually promiscuous are not standard bearers of sexual morality, and that is why the study was commissioned, in a misogynist way, to focus on only female respondents, omitting the males and forgetting that it takes two to tango.

    What the study shows is that we have a problem of delinquency amongst our youngsters involved in drugs, pornography, secret societies, vandalism, truancy and sex. Whilst delinquency is a part of moral decadence on the part of our youngsters, not enough has been studied about the moral decadence in the larger society of adults especially those in positions of power, status and responsibility.

    I suggest that the following are also manifestations of a society in moral decadence requiring study: –

    · When truth is not held in importance for its own sake but continuously repudiated or sacrificed for political expedience and goals;

    · Where academics in universities will not stand up for their work and conclusions but are prepared to succumb to the pressures of politicians and skew their findings to suit the politician’s agenda;

    · Where professionals ignore the professional ethics respecting privileged information and confidentiality of sources;

    · Repression of natural biological instinct of sex and narrow obsession with it as the single axis to determine moral virtue or decadence;

    · Making women to bear the cross of sexual restraint and foundation of sexual morality, without application of similar standards to men.

  12. #12 by patriotic1994 on Sunday, 4 March 2007 - 9:37 pm

    Sex or no sex, what has it got to do with disciplinary problem students? Good students who has no disciplinary problem also can have sex. Have they done this survey?

    Other than this news about sex, I frequently found the local newspaper publish the rape cases almost everyday. It gave the impression that while the pronography materials have been banned publicly, it is definitely available in the newspaper, daily! The writing is in such detailed manner as if it is for entertainment, not about how it affect out society and how to prevent it.

    Comparing to the Internet news such as BBC, I can say the rape cases reported are about women’s right, statistic information on cases, and the countries that most likely happen like Pakistan where women have little rights. The rape news is used to bring changes to the world to improve the women rights and protection, not as entertainment. By reading these news, you will know what you should do to help the women and also understand that women have equal rights than men, and deserve respect.

    This isn’t the case in Malaysia. Sex related news is about entertainment… who got rape, by how many people, where, when, and how it happen! This is wrong. Very wrong… you can see that this won’t help the country to improve the situation. The news served the wrong purpose.

  13. #13 by DarkHorse on Sunday, 4 March 2007 - 10:17 pm

    This is best left to the parents. Why is the government trying to usurp their role? We have to rehabilitate the parents who neglect their parental duties.

    We cannot have the government in every aspect of our lives. As parents we should not look to the government to take over the parenting.

  14. #14 by izrafeil on Sunday, 4 March 2007 - 11:01 pm

    ya lor, malay so obsessed with sex

  15. #15 by ENDANGERED HORNBILL on Monday, 5 March 2007 - 1:09 am

    “In the study conducted by UKM’s Children and Youth Psychology specialist Dr Khaidzir Ismail, all the 887 high-risk female students except for one confessed to have had experienced the “pleasure of the flesh”.

    Khir Toyo’s vehement denial syndrome is a bark up the wrong tree!!!! Woof, woof!

    Has any of the following ever occured to him:

    1) That even if 89 girls (or 10%) of the high-risk female students have had had sex, that would be a sufficiently huge headache and one requiring swift remedial counselling programs!!!
    There is no need to prove that 886 out of 887 have lost their ‘virginity’ (not necessarily losing their hymen) before Toyo begins proactively to classify this as a serious problem.

    2) The present survey sample covers girls between 15 to 16 i.e. Forms 4 and 5 girls. What if the sample had been extended to include Form 1 girls (i.e. above puberty and capable of being sexually active; ) to Form 3? It would be shockingly explosive if the survey results of girls from Form 1 to Form 3 show any hint of such alarming sexual inclinations.

    3) Seems like the present survey only covers Selangor (thus provoking Toyo’s outburst!). But we are also concerned with the actual scenario nationwide. Is this cause for concern?

    4) What is the ethnic breakdown of the survey sample? Does this tell us anything about cultural breakdowns?

    5) The survey sample lists ‘ high-risk’ girls? Aren’t all girls actually at risk in today’s hedonistic culture? What if the survey had been a random sampling of all girls? Would we be equally shocked?

    6) Girls only? Are these girls lesbians? If they are heterosexual, wouldn’t there be an equal number or more of boys exhibiting some form of the ‘aberrant’ behaviour?

    7) Are the girls or boys ‘multi-partner’ of sexual activity or ‘single-pairing’ type of sexual activity. The former would be more alarming!!!

    8) What is the incidence of STD and HIV amongst the survey sample? I may drop dead if the statistic is frightening!

    These are but a few of the questions that come to my mind. And I am not a social scientist either. So I ask questions rather than do arm-twisting.

    You see, my dear Toyo, you need to take time to ask sensible questions instead of clamming up and cramming things down researchers’ throats. Truth is often painful but it is necessary. But if the tooth is rotting and infecting the gum, causing gingivitis…how do you treat it, eh dentist Toyo! One cannot shout down to the dentist to shut up and allow the whole mouth to fester. One has to address the ‘illness’.

    So let the survey go on………independent of political manipulations! After all it’s our nation’s human capital at stake!~There’s been more than enough screw-ups (literally and figuratively) by loud-mouthed politicians who spew as much rubbish and are as filthy as the Klang river!

  16. #16 by DarkHorse on Monday, 5 March 2007 - 8:11 am

    “There is no need to prove that 886 out of 887 have lost their ‘virginity’ (not necessarily losing their hymen) before Toyo begins proactively to classify this as a serious problem.”

    Hymen? You can have them put back nowadays. Toyo and company may have been instrumental in the loss of quite a few.

  17. #17 by Open Air on Monday, 5 March 2007 - 9:38 am



    From judges to religious leaders and from professors to politicians – colorful scope of interesting individuals having common interest – fetishes in female sexuality.


  18. #18 by sotong on Monday, 5 March 2007 - 3:00 pm

    Despite strong and consistent emphasis on religion, the society is very sicked.

    Immoral and unscrupulous leaders played a significant role in this critical and shameful matter.

    Decades of cover ups and denials of our problems and weaknesses are detroying the moral fabrics of our society. If nothing is done quickly, it might reach a point of no return.

    Stop judging Western values……..look at yourself!

  19. #19 by Kingkong on Monday, 5 March 2007 - 3:07 pm

    Exactly this country emphasizes on mediocrity rather than on meritocracy. The mediocre people are easier to be manipulated like the so called mediocre psychologist whose survey report could not even survive to the questioning of an ex dentist mediocre politician. Who says the ranking of a university does not tell anything? What can you expect from professors of a university of ranking at 1503.

    ENDANGERED HORNBIL, not a social scientist himself, could even pose such well asked sensible questions. I just wonder what those kampong professors are doing in the university. At the very least, Dr K I should come out to defend his investigating work rather than immediately behave like a nodding head donkey. He is probably lost himself in his own survey without realizing what the objectives of the survey for.

    This country is ruled by warlords.

  20. #20 by atan on Monday, 5 March 2007 - 9:17 pm

    Toyo, if the findings of the report put you in shame because you are the MB of Selangor, better resign lah.

  21. #21 by dawsheng on Monday, 5 March 2007 - 11:54 pm

    sotong Says:
    Despite strong and consistent emphasis on religion, the society is very sicked.

    You all better be worry, doesn’t it beginning to sound like the middle east?

  22. #22 by japankiller on Saturday, 17 March 2007 - 12:49 am

    what it is a problem if a human having sex?

    I think the person who engaged in sex are not the main issue but instead who are so bring this issue is the matter.

    I don’t think it is a sin of having sex in the early age, as long as
    you got to make sure you are ready to take responsible and consequences. That is what our education system should have teach in the school. Just to let them know, how would you be if you got pregnant or STD when you are in younger stage.

    Remember i have read an article,
    one day a school teacher ask her students “tomorrow, everyone of you have to bring one egg to class, the will be a class activity for you”. so everyone is just feel curious and exciting about what they are going to play for this activity.
    The next day everyone just follow what have been told by their teacher bring an egg to the class. Now the teacher tell the pupil “treat the egg as a children of you, pamper it, clean up and bring them along anywhere you are going, after a week report back to me” so everyone is jst feel so excited with this game, and everyone is just follow what the teacher has been told. Putting it in the bag carry to school, bring it to shopping, play game, and give it a wash when it is dirty.
    A week later, when teacher request students finding, she found out that most of the students have broken their egg just right after a few days of the game start.
    The purpose of the game as told by teacher, “that mean, giving birth to a children is not as easy as ABC as you thought, you need spend more time, more love to taking care of your children, when you are not ready, please prevent it”

    Instead of conducting this Rubbish survey i think they should look more concern on our sex education, what is the different between having sex on teenage stage and when you are mature?And how suppose we know that we are in the right age to have sex? WHat i could say is both of them, the professor and the Toyol is half past six, try to get to the root of the problem before making any conclusion to the public.

  23. #23 by japankiller on Saturday, 17 March 2007 - 12:53 am

    And one thing, sensitive question should never be too sensitive to discuss.

    The question itself is not sensitive, but it is, if the person who thaught that it is.

    You have the right not to answer but it is not the right way to stop people from asking. That is why we need 2057 but not 2020, because we are trained, not to ask!!!!

  24. #24 by akarmalaysian on Thursday, 12 April 2007 - 6:16 pm

    does our university covers sex education?if not then its no surprise why most hv been “unvirginised”.at least these students hv the guts to venture into sumthing they hv nvr been taught before.malaysia apa pun boleh.and mr MB…if u were to fume and hop abt wif these surprising surveys done in P&C that others hv been giving u….u wud only get stupid answers fr ur stupid questions by ur department wif the way u handle this issue.

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