In the United States, Senator Barack Obama’s nomination as the Democratic Presidential nominees heralds a new milestone in American nation-building and race relations but in Malaysia, the UMNO proposal for Umno-PAS talks marks a regression in Malaysian nation-building and the Vision 2020 objective of a Bangsa Malaysia.
The latter repudiates March 8 “political tsunami” where for the first time in half-a-century of nationhood, Malaysians transcended race, religion and political affiliation to vote for change to give primacy and priority to justice, freedom, solidarity, integrity and progress.
The March 8 “political tsunami” marks a bold and visionary stride forward by Malaysians to rise above their communal selves to reach out to a common national identity.
It is a great tragedy if the transformational message of March 8 to stride forward to a new politics of justice, freedom, solidarity, integrity and progress is nullified by a throwback to the old, narrow and divisive politics of race, religion and class.
#1 by Mr Smith on Wednesday, 30 July 2008 - 4:17 pm
Let’s assume DAP, MCA and Gerakan has held secret talks to strengthen Chinese unity.
Can you imagine the insane reverberations from UMNO? They will be running like mad dogs up and down the country asking the Chinese to leave the country and branding them traitors. They might even call for the execution of these traitors.
#2 by yhsiew on Wednesday, 30 July 2008 - 4:19 pm
DSAI should expedite taking over of federal government. More troubles will emerge the longer he waits.
#3 by thepriest on Wednesday, 30 July 2008 - 4:21 pm
wait for next GE to cause another tsunami if Pas did not keep to their promises.Let PR go one to one in every seat parliment or states seat against them…lo
#4 by Amoeba on Wednesday, 30 July 2008 - 4:22 pm
I think DAP & MCA should make a secret talk for the chinese unity as what UMNO and PAS did. But the problem is MCA is a pet to UMNO.
#5 by yhsiew on Wednesday, 30 July 2008 - 4:26 pm
UMNO has to harp on racial issues in order to survive because the very reason for its existence is to champion for Malay rights.
#6 by thepriest on Wednesday, 30 July 2008 - 4:34 pm
Lets prove by next GE that the malays, chinese, indian support pas because of PKR and DAP. Malaysia Mlaysian
#7 by pselvams on Wednesday, 30 July 2008 - 4:45 pm
Never mind about all this. Did anyone read about the Pusrawi hospital press statement.
There is a similarity with the Lingam case, “It looks like Saiful medical report…….”
GOD HELP US TO SAVE ANWAR IBRAHIM
#8 by zak_hammaad on Wednesday, 30 July 2008 - 4:46 pm
Umno is continuing to court Perak PAS into forming a new state government, despite being rejected by Mentri Besar Datuk Seri Mohammad Nizar Jamaluddin.
I don’t think UMNO would be chasing PAS with such vigour if they believed the sodomy charges will stick. I hope PAS hold their resolve and no not blink in the face of UMNO blackmail.
#9 by Bigjoe on Wednesday, 30 July 2008 - 4:47 pm
I hate to admit it but since this foolish PM has chosen to signal that its OK to be racist and religious panderism, then the only choice open to those wishing for non-communal politics is to say as Karpal Singh said ‘over our dead bodies’.
If I see PAS and UMNO coming together, I myself will declare that the only leaders worthy of leading the non-Malays are those willing to die to stop Islamic state agenda and I will put myself as one of those.
#10 by badak on Wednesday, 30 July 2008 - 4:48 pm
Ong tee kiat said the talk is a ploy by PAS.Onggg please take your head out of the earth.Stop being the running dog of UMNO.It was UMNO that made the first move . Khir Toyol call Pas for a meeting after March 8 election.So that UMNO led BN Goverment will still be able to hold power in Selangor,Kedah ,Perlis and capture Kelantan.
One thing UMNO forgot was that PAS got priciples.
By the way Mr ONGGGG what will MCA do if PAS joints BN.Will MCA except PAS with hugs and kisses.
#11 by bumi-non-malay on Wednesday, 30 July 2008 - 4:50 pm
Let them talk and hope they spilt PAS up Proper…..DAP need to attract some PAS people into DAP to Neutralize PKR….a bit of competition with in Barisan Rakyat no harm.
Bring up the Freedom of religion and Freedom of muslim to convert to any Religion in Penang, Selangor, Perak…..as guranteed by the constitution. Turn the heat on the Ridiculous Theory that Malay can be Born Muslim. Use the world’s media to embarrass-malukan UMNO-PAS religious Cult.
Freedom of Religion ala Lina Joy is the Archilese Heel of UMNO-PAS…..Boycott investing in Malaysia….
By the way Malaysia KLSE is Currently under INTENSE manipulation Phase…..sell and get out, move money to Foreign Banks. Lots of Sub-Prime Business in Malaysia…all seeking to refinance……Now is the time to get out. KLSE is defying logic…that means Manipulation of Mega Scale….pity those invested and not got out….no sympathy for you at all. Deserve to lose your pants!!
#12 by qcb3838 on Wednesday, 30 July 2008 - 4:51 pm
I’m all for the Bangsa Malaysia objective. We are a unique country of many race and religion but aren’t we all Malaysians may we be Chinese, Indians, Bumiputeras, Muslim or Malay if they like. We, the Rakyat is who that makes Malaysia, Malaysia and I sure hope that those extremist politicians will not forget that. We are the ones that voted them there (albeit with regret now) and are paying for their obscenely high salary thru our taxes so we are also the ones that can take it away from them.
Remember this equation :-
Chinese + Muslims + Indians + Bumiputeras = Rakyat = MALAYSIA
#13 by alphapower on Wednesday, 30 July 2008 - 4:58 pm
MCA is a puppet party, UMNO say satu they don’t dare to say dua. Somemore say defender of the Chinese, [deleted]
#14 by yhsiew on Wednesday, 30 July 2008 - 4:59 pm
If the individual racial group starts talking about Malay unity, Chinese unity or Indian unity, in the end a “racial cold-war” will take root in Malaysia. Surely that will affect nation-building and the country’s march to developed status. I really don’t want to see that happening!
#15 by alphapower on Wednesday, 30 July 2008 - 5:02 pm
If UMNO and PAS combine power, do you think all the trouble will be settle? It come back to square one eventually.
#16 by lkc57 on Wednesday, 30 July 2008 - 5:07 pm
It’s high time Sarawakians and Sabahans flex their muscles to rid the evil PM. He is simply not fit to lead the country!
#17 by pkrisnin on Wednesday, 30 July 2008 - 5:11 pm
AAB needs PAS to vote to enact Anti-hoping law in Parliament.
#18 by pkrisnin on Wednesday, 30 July 2008 - 5:16 pm
After all the laws are passed to prevent any future hassle.
I’d say UMNO will get rid of PAS
#19 by negarawan on Wednesday, 30 July 2008 - 5:35 pm
In the next GE, cannot vote UMNO and PAS.
#20 by gofortruth on Wednesday, 30 July 2008 - 6:04 pm
UMNO is trying its level best to fan up racial unrest in the country so that they can declare a state of emergency & continue to rule. Disgusting!
But how on earth PAS, a supposedly God fearing party fell for the trap?????
#21 by AhPek on Wednesday, 30 July 2008 - 6:45 pm
‘If I see Pas and Umno coming together,I myself will declare that the only leaders worthy of leading the non Malays are those willing to die to stop Islamic state agenda and I will put myself as one of those.’. Bigjoe.
Your sentiments and convictions are not unlike those coming from down-trodden people throughout the world whose frustrations in seeing fair play and
justice vanished are now being replaced by a sense of hopelessness that will eventually trigger the survival instinct to fight back.Many of us I suspect would share your sentiments as well.
Just take a look at the black Americans who,back in the days of the cotton fields,were so badly discriminated that the whites if they so wished would kick them or rape their woman as if it was their god damn right.Even as late as the mid twentieth century the Klu Klux Klan would lasso them,tie them to the car bumper and drag them thro the streets.They have stood up since then and under the leadership of Martin Luther King and also the fact that they are also prepare to die for what they believe, the black Americans today(population:17% of American population) have taken their rightful place under the American sun.Barack Obama is 65% favoured to win the Presidency.
NOW WE IN MALAYSIA have 49% non Malay population and Malay population is around 51%.How come we are so overwhelmingly discriminated.
#22 by Loyal Malaysian on Wednesday, 30 July 2008 - 7:37 pm
To put it bluntly, it is an attempt to ensure a racist hold on the political environment in Malaysia
But that is the blunt reality, isn’t it? If UMNO is able to entice PAS to join it-[I don’t even to mention the BN , for all intents and purposes it is non-existent] ketuanan Melayu will be secured!
Likewise if Anwar is able to woo enough MP’s to swtich camp, then
ketuanan Rakyat will still have a chance.
#23 by zak_hammaad on Wednesday, 30 July 2008 - 7:58 pm
Loyal, I understand what you mean, but what’s your thoughts on equal representation in politics? With 65% Malays in Malaysia, do you not think that other races have fair representation? I said this because you used “racist hold” phrase in your above post.
If you compare representations based on ratio, there are very few other countries who have a fairer system.
Your thoughts would be appreciated, thanks.
#24 by katdog on Wednesday, 30 July 2008 - 8:02 pm
Don’t mistake PAS as a single entity. Most definitely there are those in PAS who wants to join with UMNO so they don’t have to tolerate the secular-istic ideology of DAP and PKR.
In this way not only they gain power, they can go ahead with their plans to create their vision of the ideal perfect muslim society as they no longer need to rely on the non muslim votes of DAP/PKR. Or so thats what many of these Malay elitist thinks.
But don’t forget, if PAS joins BN, Gerakan, MCA, MIC are doomed. Many MCA hardcore supporters would not be able to stomach working together with PAS. Gerakan, MCA and MIC will completely lose any remaining support they have as an UMNO-PAS led BN would definitely not go down well with many non-malays (especially those racist communal chinese MCA supporters).
If PAS joins BN, expect BN to lose any credibility it may have as a multi-racial party. I doubt BN would not let PAS join. But UMNO may allow certain factions within PAS to join them.
#25 by zak_hammaad on Wednesday, 30 July 2008 - 8:02 pm
bihjoe, many Muslims already consider Malaysia to be an Islamic state, instead of being emotionally charged by semantics, look around you and see how non-Muslims are faring in this Islamic state.
PAS’s vision of an “Islamic state” is simply a copy cat model of what they already have in Kelantan. Although we do not see this being realised anytime soon, there is not hudood laws which you should be afraid of :^)
I would urge you to see the geo-political reality of Malaysia through it’s social demography.
#26 by katdog on Wednesday, 30 July 2008 - 8:04 pm
Mistake: I doubt BN would let PAS join.
#27 by zak_hammaad on Wednesday, 30 July 2008 - 8:10 pm
katdog, MCA working with PAS is not new and they will manage this as they did previously when PAS was part of the coalition briefly in early 1990’s.
If PAS joins BN, expect Pakatan to be on the back-foot once again as BN’s skin might be saved. I just hope that PAS realise that their future does not lie within BN.
#28 by badak on Wednesday, 30 July 2008 - 8:31 pm
Zam_hanmmaad,65 % Malays… That is what the UMNO LED BN Goverment WANT US TO BELIEVE.It should be 65% Bumis.
Bumis means eurasians,Sabahans,Serawakians and orang Asli.
This 65% suits the Malays so they claim a bigger share on all goverment hand outs.
If they say that Malays are 65% .Why must all goverment application forms have 4 columns.. CHINESS,INDIANS,Malays and others.In the others column we must fill in our race,Which can be Ibans,Dayaks,Floris,Negrotos,and even eurasians.Who all come under BUMIPUTRAS.So zak_hammaads your take on 65% MALAYS is wrong .But i don,t blame you because that is what our UMNO led BN Goverment want you to think…
#29 by katdog on Wednesday, 30 July 2008 - 8:41 pm
That’s strange, i don’t recall PAS working with BN in the early 90’s. In what manner? I recall PAS and Semangat 46 formed an alliance in 1990 elections. and because of that PAS finally regained Kelantan. Although maybe PAS joined BN briefly after the UMNO-Semangat46 split.
#30 by katdog on Wednesday, 30 July 2008 - 8:47 pm
zak_hammaad Says:
“PAS’s vision of an “Islamic state” is simply a copy cat model of what they already have in Kelantan. Although we do not see this being realised anytime soon, there is not hudood laws which you should be afraid of :^)”
I don’t think this entirely correct. There will always be factions within PAS that will pander to the more conservative muslim’s and call for implementation of hudud laws to make themselves out as the true champions of Islam and brand does who does not want hudud laws as traitors and anti-Islam.
We must always be watchful of such people.
#31 by badak on Wednesday, 30 July 2008 - 8:50 pm
How not to fear an Islamic state,Even now the non muslim are losing more of their god given rights.What had happen ,Now everything is about halal and haram.What happen in Kelantan is shameful.A bunch of TRANSVESTITES was caught by the religious department.
Why do you think that most TRANSVESTITES prostitude themself,Its hard for them to get jobs.This group of people needs help from the goverment not harrasment.Is this what Islam teaches its followers.
#32 by milduser on Wednesday, 30 July 2008 - 9:01 pm
My observation is this: the merger will not and cannot take place. Reason: the two parties need to be dissolved. Do you think umno wants to dismantle its establish political structure and start all over again? even within its present system there is so much bickering and scramble for party posts and call for stepping down. What would happen in an enlarge NEW party with different ideological divide among the grassroots supporters? Then there are the component parties to answer to by UMNO. What would be their reactions? Too many ifs, to say the least. Basically, its just a political ploy of UMNO, and PAS, on their part, wish to test UMNO how far its willing to bend. Who knows, UMNO might be swallowed up PAS into non-existence (irrelevancy)
and become a member of Pakatan Rakyat. Such is the nature of politics. Surprises, surprises.
#33 by limkamput on Wednesday, 30 July 2008 - 9:26 pm
Who is the zak hammaad who tries to educate everybody here? What do you mean by ratio? Malay majority? So Malay majority means what to you? So that you can impose your will and religion around? So that you can practise your bigot racist policies?
What do you mean by equal representation in politics? So those with majority will have a bigger representation? You are still a typical racist who thinks that Malays must be represented by the Malays. Let the best govern this country, got it?
Let me tell you a secret, if NEP were to be implemented by non Malays, i think by now, there are no more poor Malays in the country and most of NEP objectives would have been achieved. YOU want to know why? You beg me and i may tell me, depending on my mood though. I don’t like to talk to a racist like you too much.
#34 by limkamput on Wednesday, 30 July 2008 - 9:28 pm
beware of zak hammaad, he is here to deliberately confuse everybody.
#35 by zak_hammaad on Wednesday, 30 July 2008 - 9:28 pm
katdog Says:
>> There will always be factions within PAS that will pander to the more conservative muslim’s and call for implementation of hudud laws to make themselves out as the true champions of Islam and brand does who does not want hudud laws as traitors and anti-Islam.
I do not like hypothetical questions and “what ifs” when it comes to race-relations as it can be detrimental to social cohesion and harmony. In the same way, one may argue that PAS would moderate their policies if they came to power because they would need to be a party for all Malaysians and not Muslims alone.
As I said before, if you see the geo-political reality of Malaysia through it’s social demography. This may lead to a sincere evaluation of what, why and how certain policies are mooted and for whom. Appreciation and respect for each other is directly linked to national stability which can never be compromised.
pkrisnin Says:
>> AAB needs PAS to vote to enact Anti-hoping law in Parliament.
This would not be good for pakatan as they rely on hop-overs to build the majority needed to take over government.
milduser, I would concur that there is more chance of PAP being dismantled in S’pore than UMNO dismantled in Malaysia :^)
#36 by katdog on Wednesday, 30 July 2008 - 9:58 pm
zak_hammaad Says:
“I do not like hypothetical questions and “what ifs” when it comes to race-relations as it can be detrimental to social cohesion and harmony. In the same way, one may argue that PAS would moderate their policies if they came to power because they would need to be a party for all Malaysians and not Muslims alone.”
Ha ha. My what if is more plausible then your what if. Has UMNO actually tried to be a party for all Malaysians rather than just the Malays in 50 years?
These people will use any political tool they have at their disposal to stay in power. And with Malays-Muslims being the majority, pandering to an ideology that caters to them is always the easiest route to gaining popular support. For UMNO the tool was the NEP and Ketuanan Melayu.
Are you actually trusting politicians to do the noble and right thing in this day and age? Especially if their political buts are on the line?
#37 by AhPek on Wednesday, 30 July 2008 - 10:10 pm
Zak, first of all your figure 65% population in Malaysia are Malays is absolutely wrong. You are like the government people who has an agenda even in taking population statistics using Bumiputra to pull wool over the eyes of others,using perhaps interchangebly Malay and Bumiputra to mean the same thing indicating to the world that Malaysia is overwhelmingly Malay which is a far cry from the truth!
A closer picture to the truth comes from Singapore and the figure I qoute is as follows:-
(a) Malay 50%
(b) non Malay Bumiputra 10%
(c) Chinese 25%
(d) Indians 8%
(e) Others
Non Malay Bumiputras are the Orang Asli from Peninsula and from Sabah and Sarawak we have the Kadazandusun,Iban,Bajau,Bisaya,Murut,Melanau and others smaller native groups.
And these true original people are also nowhere accorded the type of help as the Malays. In fact the orang asli is the most marginalised!
(c) Chinese 25%
(d) Indian 8%
(e) Others 7%
#38 by AhPek on Wednesday, 30 July 2008 - 10:12 pm
Missing figure; Others 7%
#39 by AhPek on Wednesday, 30 July 2008 - 10:14 pm
Sorry (c),(d) and (e) at the bottom of my comment are repeats.
#40 by cucu adam on Wednesday, 30 July 2008 - 10:37 pm
When will BN/UMNO learned to be civilized and accept defeat gracefully. Some of the recent events that took place before and after the recent General Election were a disgrace, shameful and embracing not only to the nation but also internationally.
Prior to the General Election, we witnessed the Lingam’s Case that confirmed that the ugly incidents did took place. It is hard to imagine the people in the top judiciary were actively involved and that it was crystal clear that court cases that were tried by those involved, their verdicts could be predetermined. What had gone wrong with our judiciary? Reforms will be introduced but the public confidence in the Malaysian Judiciary System may take sometime.
We have the Heads of the Police and the Attorney General being sued by Datuk Seri Anuar who felt that through abuses and manipulations by these two high ranking officers, Anuar was confined to Sungai Buloh Prison for 6 years and disqualified him to contest in an election until April 14 2008. These two figures should be suspended from office until the outcome of the court summons by Anuar has been decided by the Court. Never in the history of this country has these two offices being sued by individuals.
The most damaging among the events that took place is the accusation of sodomy on Datuk Seri Anuar for yet the second time. Has he not been punished enough? Recent events seemed to indicate that the sodomy did not takes place at all. The doctor who did the medical examination on the person allegedly sodomised by DSAI found the no trace of sodomy on the so called victim. DSAI was right in refusing to undergo another DNA examination for the fear that it will be abused to frame him. Any way another DNA is not required as DSAI had done 6 DNA medical examinations when he was charged on sodomy in his first sodomy case.
The government was calling it foul for the leakage of the medical reports that found it way to the internet and had been now being seen and read by millions of people all over the globe. Did the government ever think on the damage over DSAI reputation or is that not important at all. Instead of apologizing to DSAI and his family and withdrawing the case immediately, it seemed that the court case will continue to be pursued.
The government is going all out to put Anuar to shame and frustrated his desire for Pakatan Rakyat to take over the Government of Malaysia on or before September 16 2008. DSAI is now set to contest the by election at Kulim Bandar Baru very soon. It was earlier rumoured that Ezam will contest a by election if held at Bandar Tun Razak. Will he be given the chance to take Anuar if the by election is in Kulim Bandar Baru instead. Will Abdul Aziz who contested for the seat in the General Election make way for Ezam to contest the by election. It was wise of DSAI to pick Kulim Bandar Baru instead of Bandar Tun Razak.
UMNO in its efforts to cause disunity in Pakatan Rakyat proposed to have some talks (Muzakarah) with PAS (a component party of Pakatan). Are they sincere that they are serious about having talks with PAS. What now??? UMNO is even willing to let PAS to be the Menteri Besar/Ketua Menteri post to PAS if together they form a coalition government in the five states ruled by the Pakatan Rakyat. PAS should realized who are their enemies and friends. Datuk Nik Abdul Aziz did the right thing to direct his party to call off any talk with UMNO.
http://www.positivecriticism.blogspot.com
#41 by vvick on Wednesday, 30 July 2008 - 11:21 pm
Twist and turn by BN before they fall (50 years experience)! so some very ‘clever’ MPs from BN make use of PAS to see their bright bumi future. Its so cheap and silly for BN to stay in power! I dont think PAS in their best interest will divert their strong values from Pakatan Rakyat just because to save UMNO. What for to suffer again?! PAS got its life now ! no need to place and please umno ! Dont PAS has got the gut for better Islam in Malaysia ? Why should they help out the crap or to join them.BN has digged their own hole in the political arena?
and…….PAS what about non-malay muslim people ! are they not the kind of muslims that you will stand for. Non-malays voted PAS for a bright Pakatan Rakyat.
Just stop playing the racial card with BN and do served on the basis of Bangsa Malaysia. Bangsa Malaysia is ONE ! There must be tolerance for other religions too.NO DISCRIMINATIONS ! There should be only one race that is MALAYSIAN.
Rakyat have given 50 years for BN to create Bangsa Malaysia but they fail. To join the failed BN is stupid and causing disunity!
LET THE RAKYAT TO LOVE PAKATAN RAKYAT FOR BETTER CHANGE IN MALAYSIA, AND PAS SHOULD BE THERE TO BE LOVED BY ALL ,NOT HATED BY NATION.
*if Pas joins UMNO it means oil price is considered cheap for them!!!
#42 by antibagsnatching on Wednesday, 30 July 2008 - 11:22 pm
A few months back my friend’s necklace was nearly snatched away by a loner on a motorcycle. My friend is a male. It happened infront
of a motorcycle shop near my house.
Last night, while I was at the same shop, the same loner was observed scouting for victims and the shop operator informed me that it is the same culprit that attempted to snatch my friend’s necklace last time.
There were a few of us around and we all agreed that if he strike
this time we are going to bring him down and if possible kill him there and then because we know that handing him over to the police is a waste of time and energy.
That shows how much trust we have in our police.
#43 by zak_hammaad on Wednesday, 30 July 2008 - 11:34 pm
katdog Says:
>> Has UMNO actually tried to be a party for all Malaysians rather than just the Malays in 50 years?
UMNO is part of BN. Has MCA and MIC tried to be a party for their respective races? In fact the concept of BN was based on representation and not just UMNO; clearly none of them have done their jobs properly. I do not disagree that the thirst for power and status has eaten UMNO away.
I personally thnk the whole political quagmire in Malaysia stems from racial politics and moreso with incorrect identification of race with a particular religion.
Let’s look at Pakatan’s alternative; they can possibly become to the Malays, what BN was to non-Malays. By inferance, if you are going to gourge the majority, then be prepared for many more May 13 – No one wants this and there is political party worthy of treading the fine balance between a formula that is acceptable to all Malaysians.
#44 by zak_hammaad on Wednesday, 30 July 2008 - 11:42 pm
limkamput Says:
>> You are still a typical racist who thinks that Malays must be represented by the Malays.
What do you propose that the majority be ruled by a minorty? Would this even be acceptable to any stretch of the imagination to the Malays? Are you really vying for civil war? Would you be surprised to learn that I am not a Malay?
>> Let the best govern this country, got it?
Again who do you propose and we can discuss the variables.
>> Let me tell you a secret, if NEP were to be implemented by non Malays,
In your utopian and orwellian world, everything is measurable in black and white. Well I have a ‘secret’ of my own… Society is not like that, especially with a country as unique as Malaysia; you can’t simplify everything in black and white.
I totally agree with you on NEP and it’s objectives (or the lack of), but not not allow the NEP to emotionally charge you; Then you start to accuse others of racism when in fact you hatred for the majority is becoming apparent. Now you will say that you do not hate Malays but UMNO, well I would like to remind you that approx 60% of Malays still voted for UMNO and the remainder are divided between secularists, Islamists and ‘dont knows’.
For you to get your utopian version of Malaysia is akin to PAS’s version of a “greater Kelantan”. How do you want it changed? Different people have different cultures and forge different consensus and seek different solutions to their problems. Western-styled, secular and liberal democracy for example is not viable for Malaysia. You have shown NO practical solutions how you would not only change the style of government, but more importantly how you would change the mindset of many Malaysians. I would urge you too, to see the geo-political reality of Malaysia through it’s social demography.
#45 by undergrad2 on Thursday, 31 July 2008 - 12:07 am
“…I would like to remind you that approx 60% of Malays still voted for UMNO and the remainder are divided between secularists, Islamists and ‘dont knows’ zak_hammaad
Source(s)??
If you cannot give your sources, perhaps you should just simmer down – and just shut up.
#46 by lhslhv on Thursday, 31 July 2008 - 12:26 am
“Many more May 13”
Those who had killed during the May 13 riot are quite old by now. It is their turn!
#47 by limkamput on Thursday, 31 July 2008 - 12:45 am
First you take a long time to write few lines. Your standard must be quite low.
1. What do you propose that the majority be ruled by a minorty? Would this even be acceptable to any stretch of the imagination to the Malays? Are you really vying for civil war? Would you be surprised to learn that I am not a Malay?
Did i say that? Undergrad2 did not hammered for no good reason. I said let the best govern this country. You and your moronic ratio. Shaft it, ok.
#48 by limkamput on Thursday, 31 July 2008 - 12:50 am
Are you really vying for civil war? Would you be surprised to learn that I am not a Malay? zak
Do you think i care whether you are a Malay, a Chinese or a Chidian? Only a racist or an apologist needs to emphasize his/her race. What F* civil war are you talking about? You mean it is ok to let the plundering to go on no matter what?
#49 by limkamput on Thursday, 31 July 2008 - 12:57 am
>> Let the best govern this country, got it?
Again who do you propose and we can discuss the variables. zak
who do I propose? i thought i just did – let the best govern. How many times do you want me to tell you. Just for your info, a black is on the verge of becoming the president of a white majority country – a country that practised slavery at one time. Why do you think we are so special? Please don’t come back to tell me that we are different, we have different history, we need more time. I heard all these before and i am not interested.
#50 by limkamput on Thursday, 31 July 2008 - 1:01 am
Western-styled, secular and liberal democracy for example is not viable for Malaysia. zak
who say so? you? who are you? western styled secular and liberal democracy should have been vigorously adhered to yesterday if not from the first day of our independence.
#51 by devilmaster on Thursday, 31 July 2008 - 1:08 am
zak_hammaad, or better known as littlefox in Lowyat.net forum; when you come to a political blog to post your opinions, you must be prepared with some disagreements from others. You cannot expect everyone to share your views. You dont have moderators here siding by your side too.
You were once got flamed in RPK’s Malaysia-Today, for unknown reasons to me. Like i always said, i respect everybody’s opinions provided it is logic & constructive, unlike all those stupid chidings by RealWorld.
#52 by limkamput on Thursday, 31 July 2008 - 1:16 am
well I would like to remind you that approx 60% of Malays still voted for UMNO and the remainder are divided between secularists, Islamists and ‘dont knows’. zak
You have shown NO practical solutions how you would not only change the style of government, but more importantly how you would change the mindset of many Malaysians. I would urge you too, to see the geo-political reality of Malaysia through it’s social demography. zak
Let me tell you this, even if 60% of Malays voted for UMNO, it is also the time to change. It is blatantly clear the government and the country is not working. It is time they are told to accept the reality (not your geo-political reality) if they want food on the table and if they want the country to move forward. We can’t have an affirmative programme for the majority indefinitely.
Precisely we are letting the stupid mindset to linger on for the last 50 years and that is why we are seeing the country moving backward. Malays must be told by enlightened Malays that there are no free lunches.
#53 by undergrad2 on Thursday, 31 July 2008 - 5:59 am
limkamput,
I like your “coconut head” comment of zak_hammaad. Even his nick has got to be unusual. Is it Zaki bin Mohammad?
#54 by yhsiew on Thursday, 31 July 2008 - 8:12 am
PAS spiritual leader, Datuk Nik Abdul Aziz Nik Mat, is an experienced politician.
I believe he is testing UMNO “political waters and reaction” in the current PAS-UMNO events.
#55 by ablastine on Thursday, 31 July 2008 - 8:29 am
PAS is likely not stupid enough to really want to join UMNO. They are probably just toying UMNO just like a cat playing with the mouse before eating it. Why would they really want to jump on board a sinking ship. It is not that difficult to see that the invitation by UMNO for talks are simply last cries of desperation before their demise.You don’t hear them accommodating PAS when they were strong. Even if the alliance really become reality, how long would it last. Until the next election probably. That is not too far away really by the time the alliance can come on full steam.
Pandering to UMNO wishes by joining them at this juncture is nothing less than betrayal to the electorate who elected them on an opposition ticket. What will PAS get in return for such a costly antic. Malay Unity and other nonsense comes about only when UMNO needed them to save their own ass. When UMNO were helping themselves to the countries wealth how come PAS was not invited for the sake for Malay unity. In any case the MB of Perak is already from PAS. Why would PAS kiss UMNO ass. What can they really get in return for being labelled a traitor. They are at grave risk of loosing their credibility by jumping ship like this.
In any case the reason why UMNO lost in the 5 States is because the people are fed up with them robbing the country. It has nothing to do with Malays unity or disunity. If PAS join them in the robbery, I don’t think they need to see the light of day in the next election. They will just die together with UMNO. PAS is not that stupid. They would not have been able to take Kelantan from the BN if they are really so dimwit.
#56 by oknyua on Thursday, 31 July 2008 - 9:05 am
I am still puzzled with the demise of Kassim Amat – sorry not “demise”, but his disappearance. Godfather, is he still stuck in Putra Jaya, lobbying for a Mercs 200 for us?
#57 by Sagaladoola on Thursday, 31 July 2008 - 9:21 am
My writing on this issue……
Title:
Will PAS Embrace Islam Hadhari or Join BN?
Link:
http://sagaladoola.blogspot.com/2008/07/will-pas-embrace-islam-hadhari-or-join.html
#58 by Bigjoe on Thursday, 31 July 2008 - 9:26 am
Let me make my stand clear. Its one thing to fight for a new idea of Islamic state whatever that may be, its quite another to constitutional say the Quran is supreme.
A constitutional theocracy, where a religious text is supreme is no different than one based on Mein Kampf, or thinking of Das Kapital, OR The little Red Book. I have seen those lives personally as I have seen how Saudi Arabia and other middle east countries including the prosperous Dubai, Kuwait. That I won’t put my children and future generation. If they want to do that, then either they take my life or buy my assets and pay for my losses and let us leave by allowing us to declare ourselves as political refugees. I cannot answer to my children and grandchildren into a future which I already know will rob of them of their future without sacrificing all that I can to protect them.
#59 by britcrazelady on Thursday, 31 July 2008 - 11:52 am
qcb3838,
“Chinese + Muslims + Indians + Bumiputeras = Rakyat = MALAYSIA”
Q : If the equation is true, why aren’t the Chinese + Indians not given EQUAL RIGHTS & BENEFITS? Why must there be “Bumiputra rights”? AND why is there a need for implementation of hudud? Why is there a need for MALAY unity and not MALAYSIANS unity? Are the Chinese + Indians “Malaysians”?
#60 by britcrazelady on Thursday, 31 July 2008 - 12:03 pm
It’s funny why countries like England for example, which is also ruled by a written Constitution can have fair play, ie; their Constitution isn’t drafted in accordance to the Bible (their monarch is under Church of England, right?) – and benefits all races? Why is the Malaysian written Constitution drafted “with reference” to the Quran, and benefits “one race” more than the other?
#61 by Yee Siew Wah on Thursday, 31 July 2008 - 12:36 pm
I hv great respect and faith for PAS after the March 8. However, with their recent dealings with the umnoputras I am now sick of their Malay unity and religious issues agenda. Islam does not work this way i hope. PAS has shown their true colours. Can the non-muslims trust them? I bet. Of course there some good muslims in PAS like our Perak MB Nihar. I admire him so far on what he has done for the rakyat as a whole. A realistic and open minded MB.
Hope he will keep it up.
I hope he join PKR or try to open those numbskulls in PAS to face the world globally in a practical and realistic way. U cannot hv progress,peace etc… if u still have stone-age mentality in running a multi-racial rakyat like Malaysia.
#62 by alphapower on Thursday, 31 July 2008 - 4:05 pm
To all my fellow Malaysian, let us pray that 31/08/08 will be the last Merdeka for all the BN goon to stand on the grand stand. Next year they will be the spectator.
#63 by Emily Pratt on Thursday, 31 July 2008 - 4:42 pm
PAs has just given UMNO their middle finger… yup there will never be any coalition on state and federal level btw PAS & UMNO.
As reported in Malaysia Insider today 31.07.08
KUALA LUMPUR, July 31 — Pas has rejected any coalition government with Umno or the Barisan Nasional at both state or federal level, party president Datuk Seri Abdul Hadi Awang said today, ending the controversial unity talks with its ideological nemesis that have rocked both the ruling and opposition coalitions.
“The issue of Umno’s offer to Pas therefore does not arise,” Abdul Hadi said after a rare joint meeting between Pas’s central working committee and its highest decision-making body, the Majlis Syura Ulamak (religious scholars consultative council).
Pas has been embroiled with the secret meetings between its leaders including Abdul Hadi and Prime Minister Datuk Seri Abdullah Ahmad Badawi, and Umno’s offer to some state Pas leaders to form coalition state governments in Perak and Selangor — both now under the federal opposition’s Pakatan Rakyat. Umno, however, has not invited Pas to join other Barisan Nasional state governments.
Abdul Hadi also reaffirmed the party’s commitment to Pakatan Rakyat, the nascent coalition that groups the Islamist party with Parti Keadilan Rakyat and the Democratic Action Party that denied BN its traditional two-thirds parliamentary majority in the 222-seat Parliament with its 82 seats and unprecedented control of five states.
He said Pas was grateful to the non-Muslim community for supporting the party in the March 8 general election, adding it was prepared to meet political organisations and non-governmental organisations to discuss issues of mutual interest.
He urged Umno members to quit en masse and join the Pakatan Rakyat coalition members.
EP
#64 by barble on Thursday, 31 July 2008 - 5:23 pm
we can all sit in front of our computers and write about the incompetence of our politicians, the polices lack of interest in making malaysia more safe and the shameful judiciary system that we have in this country. But we the citizens of Malaysia has never made a stand on our right to be the ‘voice’ and do our
job to ensure the right person runs our country and makes us feel safe to live here like our parents and parents before them….
we can’t even walk in our own neighborhood to visit our neighbors across the streets, because of the fear that we would be harmed by a thief or rapist. our own children are not safe in their own housing play grounds…. why is this happening????
its all because we the citizens are not voicing enough of our frustration in public.. i don’t mean in the internet where its only writing, but actually going head to head with our elected politicians(politicians that we vote, our votes that put them where they are now) and pressure them to be more responsible in their actions as the elected leaders in this country.
do more public protests.. do you actually think that jails in malaysia can fit 26million malaysians??? obviously not right… and by doing this will not only impose fear in the politicians but they will definitely do they jobs well…
we malaysians are no ‘UNITED’ in wanting what ‘WE’ want and how we want our country to be… we malaysians just gossip, talk behind backs, curse and swear but at the end of the day do not show our frustrations to ensure that there are heard. why we do this? because a typical malaysian will answer you, that they just hide it and keep mum when it comes going against the government, is because they have mouths to feed…
let me tell you all here, if we don’t do what we have to do to make sure our country is a safe place to live for us, our children and the next generations…
we all will not have jobs to feed them anyway… so why bicker behind the scenes??? ask yourselves why not do much more than that??? are we not capable to do so??? are we the voice of this country???? is this a democratic country??? ask yourselves these questions… i am hoping it will open all of your eyes..
#65 by zak_hammaad on Thursday, 31 July 2008 - 6:03 pm
limkamput Says:
>> i thought i just did – let the best govern.
Who defines “best”? What processes are used to select? How do you overcome objections for other sides? etc etc.
>> Just for your info, a black is on the verge of becoming the president of a white majority country – a country that practised slavery at one time.
Not black enough for some, but nevertheless a start.
>> Why do you think we are so special?
Diversity of races, religions and cultures; where laws are drafted and political parties are created to server specific purposes for specific races. This you will not find in the US.
If you are talking about overhauling the status quo, then again please answer my question on “how” you intend to do this rather than “we need to do it”.
#66 by zak_hammaad on Thursday, 31 July 2008 - 6:19 pm
devilmaster Says:
>> zak_hammaad, or better known as littlefox in Lowyat.net forum;
Instead of assuming, stay on the topic. fyi, I’ve never visisted that forum and don’t intend to (if your purpose was to advetise for it :^)
>> You were once got flamed in RPK’s Malaysia-Today, for unknown reasons to me.
LOL, is that what you call it. Try the archives and see my postings. The so-called champion of ‘free speech’ barred my account because truth was getting a little too hot for him. She should have got out of the kitchen :^) If he goes to prison or becomes bankrupt, he has only himself to blame.
The whole purpose of blogs as you say, is for sharing of ideas and agreeing to disagree in many parts; issues of this nature are not concluded in stone and it’s the diversity that makes us who we are. limkamput might want to think about “unity in diversity” when he proposes radical and evolutionary ideas without the “how”.
#67 by limkamput on Thursday, 31 July 2008 - 8:22 pm
zak, we are already doing it, and if you can’t see it, you are an idiot.
By the way am i not reporting to you? You want my ideas, please beg me, may be i will consider telling you.
#68 by zak_hammaad on Thursday, 31 July 2008 - 10:14 pm
AhPek, I should have made it clear that the figure quoted was for “bumi-puteras” and not just Malays. I understand that many people have a vested interested to perpetuate lies so that minorities can justify a bigger stake of influence. I don’t understand why there is so much fear of statistics.
S’pore is not an impartial source for this as for example, they’ve been putting the Malays at 14% for more than 2 decades despite Malays having bigger families. S’pore continues to socially engineer the makeup of it’s population by retaining this figure by way of Chinese neuturalisation as well as giving non-Malays easy access for settlement etc.
In the same degree, S’pore continues to put the figure of Muslims at 14% despite the fact there are sizeable Indian Muslims and well as pockets of Arab and other Muslims (a more realistic figure is 17-18%). So % of Malays do not equal % of Muslims.
Beyond this, we find PAP actively promoting Christianity so as to relegate Islam to 3rd place. There are more than twice as many churches as there are mosques despite the fact that Christians make up 15% of the population.
When it comes to Malaysia, I’m sure the discerning readership of this blog can at least conclude the follows stats:
Muslims: 62%
Buddhists: 20%
Christians: 9%
Hindu: 6%
Others: 3%
#69 by limkamput on Thursday, 31 July 2008 - 10:40 pm
we find PAP actively promoting Christianity so as to relegate Islam to 3rd place. zak
this is what i call third world half baked people talking.
#70 by limkamput on Thursday, 31 July 2008 - 10:41 pm
S’pore is not an impartial source for this as for example, they’ve been putting the Malays at 14% for more than 2 decades despite Malays having bigger families. zak
prove it, don’t need to talk c*ck here.
#71 by limkamput on Thursday, 31 July 2008 - 10:43 pm
it clear that the figure quoted was for “bumi-puteras” and not just Malays. zak
See how greedy is a** is. You have exploited enough of non bumi, now you want to exploit the bumi from
Sarawak and Sabah. You tell me what did the bumi from Sabah and Sarawak get?
#72 by limkamput on Thursday, 31 July 2008 - 10:48 pm
I understand that many people have a vested interested to perpetuate lies so that minorities can justify a bigger stake of influence.
why you keep talking minority and majority? what is your motive? so that you can continue to scr*w us, zak? What is so great about the majority, when what they do is to bring the country backward. Why should minority stand by and let the country destroyed. We have everyright to take control and see that all, majority and minority, make progress. This is much better than your tribal leadership which only bring destruction, destitute and misery.
#73 by zak_hammaad on Friday, 1 August 2008 - 12:19 am
limkamput Says:
>> this is what i call third world half baked people talking.
Clearly you have no independent acumen. Your research probably comes from wholly anti-estbalishment material.
>> why you keep talking minority and majority?
Because this is a fact of life. You want equal representation while ignoring the fact that the majority will never accept it. To change their mindset requires persuasive arguments.
>> what is your motive? so that you can continue to scr*w us, zak?
“you can”; I have not authority to do anything from the top, in fact I am not even Malay as I told you before. There is no motive, it is a simple reflection of the social demographic reality that you continue to IGNORE.
>> What is so great about the majority,
Nothing much, except that they have an inherent stake to the country and the would not like the social contract to be shot down casually over the newly formented political ambitions of the minorities and anti-Muslim forces.
#74 by limkamput on Friday, 1 August 2008 - 12:47 am
owah, social contract, casually shot down, come on, what are you getting at?
How you think our social contract should be. Lots of things change by default or in the course of time. So casually shot down may be is changing by default or may be it is time, got it?
#75 by limkamput on Friday, 1 August 2008 - 12:59 am
Because this is a fact of life. You want equal representation while ignoring the fact that the majority will never accept it. To change their mindset requires persuasive arguments. zak
why keep saying this moronic thing! why are you assuming the majority government is deciding for the interests of majority? They rule in the name of majority but they are for parochial interests. The change has just begun, and it will take its course. Sorry you can’t stop the train now. Taking about lack of discernment, I think you are the epitome of that. We will achieve secular, liberal and cosmopolitan Malaysia because it is inclusive, sustaining and acceptable to most people and the global community. The opposition is Myanmar or North Korea or Zimbabwe. We will never allow that to happen because everybody has a stake here, not just your “majority”, whichever way your coconut head chooses to define it. By the way, majority does not always means right, hope you heard that before.
#76 by limkamput on Friday, 1 August 2008 - 1:04 am
sorry, the last line should be: majority is not always right.
#77 by sirrganass on Friday, 1 August 2008 - 1:31 am
Hello friends…. by today, 1st August 2008, the games is OVER! Pas is with Pakatan Rakyat and has rejected UMNO/BN. Full Stop. Let’s go back to work. Thanks!