Hindraf demo – PM should heed “cry of desperation” of Malaysian Indians at marginalisation

The Prime Minister, Datuk Seri Abdullah Ahmad Badawi flew into a royal rage yesterday at the Hindraf allegation that the Malaysian Government was carrying out “ethnic cleansing” of the Indians in Malaysia.

Abdullah was referring to a Hindraf memorandum to the British Prime Minister, Gordon Brown asking for the intervention of the UK government over the “ethnic cleansing” of Indians in Malaysia.

This Hindraf memorandum to Brown was dated 15th November 2007, the same day as the demolition of the Mariaman temple in Padang Jawa, Shah Alam, Selangor.

I did not know about this Hindraf memorandum until I read about it on the blog,
http://rockybru.blogspot.com/, on Monday, 26th November 2007 and I do not agree with such an allegation. I have no doubt that the overwhelming majority of the 30,000 Indians who rallied to the Hindraf demonstration in Kuala Lumpur on Sunday, 25th November 2007 were not aware of the Hindraf memorandum to the British Prime Minister and that they would not have agreed with the term.

Abdullah should not just rage over the Hindraf allegation of “ethnic cleansing” but must pay heed to the “cry of desperation” of 30,000 Indians from all over the country at last Sunday’s Hindraf demonstration over the marginalization of the Malaysian Indian community – political, economic, educational, social and cultural.

I recommend the heart-searing email by a Malaysian Indian, Ananthi, who is currently a Rhodes Scholar in Oxford University for reflection by the Prime Minister, Cabinet Ministers and all Barisan Nasional leaders for them to understand why law-abiding and peaceful loving Malaysian Indians have rallied in support of the Hindraf demonstration — not over any accusation of “ethnic cleansing of Indians in Malaysia” but to call for an immediate halt to the long-standing marginalization of the Malaysians Indians which have reduced them into a new underclass in the country.

Ananthi did not fully agree with all the things said and done by Hindraf. She said however that “it would be duplicitous” for her not to support last Sunday’s Hindraf rally, adding:

“Because I, like many of you, know that that is not what this rally was about.

“It was about being neglected, about not having a seat at the table to bargain, about having a national and communal leadership that we do not trust and is utterly discreditable. It is about saying no to being the forgotten Indians, and not enough of us in our comfortable houses, those of us who managed to work the system to our benefit – stood with the other Indians, who are not so different from us.”

Ananthi’s agony was the agony of the 30,000 Malaysian Indians from all over the country who congregated in Kuala Lumpur last Sunday to send a clear and unmistakable message to the Prime Minister, Cabinet, Parliament and government — that they do not want to continue to be the “forgotten” and marginalised Malaysians.

It is sad and tragic that a week after the 30,000-strong Hindraf demonstration, there seems to be neither awareness nor consciousness in top government circles that this unprecedented and largest gathering of Malaysian Indians must be treated as a “wake-up” call by the Cabinet and government policymakers to adopt immediate measures to formulate a New Deal for Justice to Malaysian Indians to end their marginalization from the mainstream of national development.

The government response to the “cry of desperation” of the Malaysian Indian community to end their marginalization is one so rooted in denial or so puny that they have only aggravated the sense of alienation and deprivation of the Indians as a forgotten and marginalized community.

MIC President, Datuk Seri S. Samy Vellu said on Thursday that the Prime Minister had asked the MIC to set up a special committee to analyse and address socio-economic problems faced by the Indian community. He also announced that the MIC will set up a hotline as soon as possible to handle all problems faced by the Indian community.

These responses are so ridiculous and laughable that they only illustrate the continuing government irrelevance and MIC impotence in ending the marginalization of the Malaysian Indian community in the country.

Samy Vellu would have set up scores if not a century of committees to study the problems of the Indian community in his more than 28 years as MIC President and Cabinet Minister — and if they had been totally useless in checking the marginalization of the Indian community, how is another MIC committee going to make any difference?

The whole idea of a hotline to resolve the problem of the Indian community is utterly absurd as what is needed are structural, institutional and policy changes in government and nation-building strategies — which no number of hotlines can achieve.

Tomorrow, the MIC Cameron Highlands Member of Parliament S. K. Devamany is to appear before Deputy Prime Minister and Barisan Nasional chief whip, Datuk Seri Najib Razak for his remark in Parliament that the Hindraf demonstration, which he put at 50,000, reflected government failures in nation-building.

I had berated Devamany for his Aljazeera interview the day before during the Hindraf demonstration in belittling and questioning the bona fides of the tens of thousands of Malaysian Indians who had gathered in Kuala Lumpur to convey their “cry of desperation” for justice to the government.

I had told Devamany that he should apologise for the contemptuous language he had used when referring to the tens of thousands of Indians who had turned up in Kuala Lumpur to support the Hindraf demonstration to prove that he was not being opportunistic.

However, if Devamany is prepared to stand by his parliamentary remark that the Hindraf demonstration was proof of the government’s failures in nation-building and “a cry of desperation” by the marginalized Indian community which must be heard and acted on by the government, then he must be supported by the MIC President, Datuk Seri S. Samy Vellu and all other MIC members of the administration — whether Deputy Minister, Parliamentary Secretary or MP.

In fact, Samy Vellu and all MIC members of the administration should accompany Devamany to meet Najib to demonstrate that they support Devamany that the Hindraf demonstration showed the government’s failures and was a “cry of desperation” of the Indian community for justice and that the Minister in the Prime Minister’s Department, Datuk Seri Nazri Aziz was wrong in labeling the demonstrators as “crooks” (penyangak).

Furthermore, the MIC team should extract a commitment from Najib that Wednesday’s Cabinet meeting will give top priority to address the “cry of desperation” of the 30,000 Indians at the Hindraf demonstration by putting on the agenda a New Deal for Justice to end the marginalization of the Malaysian Indians.

  1. #1 by MISHUGINA on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 12:48 pm

    Yesterday AAB rattled ” I have big ears”

    Today was the usual ostrich-head-in-sand syndrome.

    Maybe he was right when he yesterday he also mentioned “telinga pun sakit”. He should bear in mind that statement isn’t solely exclusive to him. Aren’t we all sick of his spin-doctoring BS?

  2. #2 by hutchrun on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 12:54 pm

    Big Ears is very sick. Asleep most of the time, now he`s got split personality. No more hope.

  3. #3 by hutchrun on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 12:56 pm

    More evidence of the talibanisation of malaysia by UMNO thru active participation by pakistani ISI agents:

  4. #4 by negarawan on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 1:04 pm

    I wish all the best to HINDRAF in its efforts in highlighting and gaining international help to denounce and condemn the formal apartheid regime of UMNO. The untold number of deaths and serious injuries caused by the UMNO-sponsored police force against peaceful demonstrators must be told to the world. The cruelty and constant lies from UMNO are beyond words.

  5. #5 by don on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 1:23 pm

    Sir, I joined the rally to show my support of an Indian upper middle class and wanted the Msian government to address my community’s grievances. Individually, I ‘fought’ to ensure that temples, schools & even a public company which belongs to Indians were properly managed and accountable for their actions. In every problem, MIC’s name kept cropping up. They are responsible.As a Malay proverb goes, “Harapkan pagar, pagar makan padi.”

    The saffron sunday rally brought all our Indian professionals together and admitted the malady started because MIC has completely ignored the Indians, who have not mastered their mother tongue but bilingual in English & Malay. They could not identify with cheap caste politics of MIC grassroots. At every nook & corners, when they want to assist the communities on their accord, the Government policies are just the same- Go and see the MIC. As though the MIC is a quasi-Government for the Indians.

    The rally is a sign of a rejection of MIC. If 30,000 had marched on the faithful day, it was a much more bigger representation of our 2 Million Malaysian Indians in terms on percentage compared to that of Bersih march. If the government is still asking the MIC, of all people to set up hotline & other stupid methods to get our feedbacks, then the next course of actions would be exercised to curb the MIC. We strongly believed that MIC had gained everything that were given for the Indians thru their own agendas & greed has overcome them.

    If Badawi is still grappling and listening to the truth from a liar like Samy, Abdullah has seriously failed. The 22 years with Mahathir’s regime completely wrecked Indians hope. We thought Badawi rescued us with is slogan, I’m the PM for all Malaysians. But Badawi who hails from BMHS (his school and mine) which carries a motto called “Accomplish or Do not Begin”, i conclude that he is not fit to claim as an old boy of this esteemed institution.

  6. #6 by Godfather on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 1:24 pm

    For over 20 years, whatever crumbs that were thrown the way of the Indian community would be monopolised by Semi Value. He managed to convince Mahathir that he would be responsible for distributing the goodies, but of course the goodies only went to him and his buddies. He became the enforcer for UMNO in respect of government construction contracts, so much so that he became indispensable as Works Minister. Voices of dissent within the Indian community would be quickly squashed, usually through the threat and use of force. Yet at every election, the Indians supported the BN and Semi Value, and took in all his promises, thinking that one day – one fine day – the promises might just come true.

    The Indians somehow believe that Semi Value could deliver them from poverty and hunger. After all, he did deliver on sewing machines and angpows at every election. Their patience with Semi Value, though admirable, is clearly misguided. Is it due to a lack of alternatives ? Is it due to a feeling of helplessness ?

  7. #7 by justice_fighter on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 1:35 pm


    1. 我国的廉洁排名,从24名降到28名,在从28名,降到今年的32名。

    2. 外债达到马币1000亿。

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    4. 政府常常以招纳外资为由,组团到外国看肚皮舞。单单是许子根,一年就出国几次。花的都是你我的钱!!!

    5. 政府总共批准了4000多项私营计划。

    6. 私营化的三部曲是:(1)有“路”和搞好关系的人得到政府的重托而接管有关计划;(2)效率降低,亏损累累;(3)政府介入拯救。

    7. 政府强调,私营化为政府省下数千亿马币的费用,可是当私营计化亏损,政府就回收,这好像是赚钱私营化赚,亏损却由政府承担。

    8. 为了安抚朋党,国阵想尽办法把所有的东西私营化。

    9. 总共有200多项私营计划因为亏损而被政府收回,亏损额达600亿马币。其中英达立水占了近50亿。

    10. 政府收回私营企业,又以马航最荒缪,因为政府以每股RM8.00,向马航回收所有股份,可是当时马航股价只有RM2.00,为何政府会出此高价?因为当年马航主席,是以每股RM8.00,向政府购买马航。

    11. 南北大道,一起再起,合约不透明,原本到2018年,可是获准一再延迟到2038年7月。

    12. 入口车准證不公开,沒有公佈名單与細節又如何可以称为“非常透明”呢?人民都是傻瓜嗎?

    13. 公共交通系统没有规划,造成年年亏损。

    14. 槟榔屿外环大道收费公司即将在槟州出现,而得标者是Setegap Bhd,一家PN4公司,透明度在哪里?

    15. 劳民伤财,花了一大堆钱搞美化。

    16. 浪费公币,搞一些不实际的大白象。

    17. 不切实际的幻想,比如说14年超越中国,7年内超越新加坡,自称雪州为先进州。

    18. 因为太多的议员,造成政府大兴土木,好让所有人有的分。

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    22. 汽油,电费,水费,一起再起。

    23. 教育制度不完善,连世界有名的北京大学都不承认,反而承认印尼一所无名大学。

    24. 统考已经被世界多所有名大学承认,只有我国不成认。

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    26. 近10万名土著大学生失业。

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    28. 公积金局虽然拥有数千亿的资金,却年年亏损,主要是时常拯救有问题的公司。

    29. 公积金局的账面亏损,从1998年的4.35亿马币,狂升到2004年49.68马币。

    30. 国家石油变成私人财产,因为只有老马可以调动国家石油的资金。

    31. 竞争能力一再下跌,早期不如新加坡,然后不如泰国,现在又不如越南,会不会最后不如印尼?

    32. 强调广招人才回流,却对人才诸多为难。

    33. 我要听真话,我要做全民的首相,沦为口号。

    34. 反贪污喊了那么久,有什么大鳄被告?

    35. 政府部门常常用该部门的紧急储备金,来购买文具,电脑等不紧急的东西。

    36. 再大,再豪华的建筑物,没有好好的管理,最后也成为废物。

    37. 华小师资荒已经很严重,但为何要申请成为老师却面对刁难?

    38. 沙前首长事件,证明只要一上位,短期内就能成为暴发户。

    39. 国阵通过太多太多不利人民的条例。

    40. 股市被财团控制,人民的钱化为乌有。

    41. 市议会往往没有以人民利益为主,胡乱制定条例。

    42. 警察滥权,其善怕恶。

    43. 朝夕令改,没有深入研究。

    44. 治安败坏,人心惶惶。

    45. 为人降低犯罪案,警察阻止人民报案。才用“鸵鸟政策”。

    46. 控制媒体,对异议者加以封杀。

    47. 为了巩固政权,进行不公平的选区划分。

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  8. #8 by hutchrun on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 1:37 pm

    Anor one:

    Radio Republik Indonesia (30/11/2007): Seorang Warga Negara Indonesia (WNI) dipukuli oleh polisi di kantor polisi, Shah Alam, Selangor, Senin (26/11) tengah malam, hanya karena tidak bisa menunjukkan paspor asli yang sedang digunakan untuk mengurus perpanjangan `special pass` (ijin tinggal) di Imigrasi Putrajaya.

  9. #9 by LittleBird on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 1:45 pm

    YB, speak up and tell off HINDRAF to remove the misleading points. YAB also said the MEMO was a lie. Don’t just say you disagree with some parts. Rocky’s Bru also asked. So which parts you agree and which you don’t?

    This gives opportunity to the blind supporters of HINDRAF to know real truth before being misled some more.

  10. #10 by hutchrun on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 2:05 pm

    Me not blind. I support hindraf.

  11. #11 by hutchrun on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 2:07 pm

    At least Anwar has teh right mind to say this seeing the Indians have no one to speak up in their defence, the Malsysian government dont give a crap about Indians. There are those who in my thoughts are too dumb to even realise who what teh Indians have done for Malaysia, and these dumb idoit ( example Rustam)want to revoke our citizenship, do not understand that it was teh hard work of Indian laborers who tapped rubber and Chinese who worked in tin mines, was what started the Malaysian economy. But the ungrateful Malsys now want to shed blood of these Indians, spray tear gas on a peaceful protest, and the procession was not to teh Malaysian government but to speak to teh British. Idiots, ungrateful idiots, this government is , you have forgoten who worked to jumstart Malayas economy, my father fought with teh British, against teh japanese and later teh Communist, but when he retired with aheavy heart and informed his children not to join this Mlay biased government. So India has teh fight to speak up on the behalf of these Indian who have sacrificed all for this country , since no one else cares.

    Anyway I am no longer in Malaysia, I love my country, but I hate the extremely racially biased government who treat Indians as though we were lower class people.

    11:05 AM


  12. #12 by ihavesomethingtosay on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 2:08 pm

    “Hindraf demo – PM should heed “cry of desperation” of Malaysian Indians at marginalisation”

    HINDRAF demo, PM should take this rare chance to reflect on thier blatant racial descrimintation policy and take the best course to correct, correct and correct the NEP, social contract and rights of all marginalised Malaysians.

    Our PM has at every turn of event demonstrates his inability to lead and work for Malaysia, along with his party has at every turn demonstrates that they are nothing but racist bigots.

    PM has not lead, he has shown no leadership ability and is incapable to perform in his job; PM should resign.

  13. #13 by Libra2 on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 2:11 pm

    Is the PM sure that this memo is the original or not a doctored version of it?
    Why is so sure that it is original and contain lies. OK, the ethnic cleansing part is lie. What about the other allegations? If Lingam clip need a three man committee to authenticate it, why not this Memo?
    UMNO seems to have gone berserk and suffering from acute epilepsy over Hindraf. Day anfter day they are at it. There is no end to the demonization of the Indians.
    No, PM, you will not win points for hitting out at them every day. It is you who will fall sick.

  14. #14 by wits0 on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 2:28 pm

    Bad-awi was angry? He should be told that lots of people have not been too amused with umno/bn for a very long time over a wide array of issues caused by the fascist-racist ways of umno. But I guess his big ears can never hear that.

  15. #15 by LittleBird on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 2:28 pm

    What is ethnic cleansing?
    What is UN definition for it? What is Oxford definition for it?

  16. #16 by LittleBird on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 2:30 pm


  17. #17 by ktteokt on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 2:59 pm

    AAB is spiritually bankrupt for what he had promised when he ascended the position of PM was not kept and realized, so whatever his subsequent promises do not hold any credit. Only fools would believe what he say today.

  18. #18 by lakshy on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 3:56 pm

    ktteokt, and there are many of those in umno and in malaysia, and they will still turn out and vote for bn after some simple promises and some threats are made. Of course some will be paid to do so. While in other areas there will be wholesale vote rigging. Just wait and see.

  19. #19 by HJ Angus on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 5:06 pm

    The PM should refrain from pontificating on how good the government has been when so many thousands have been marginalised through the various NEP programs.

    The NEP has created a new type of disease – even those who do not need such hand-outs after 37 years are still clamouring for more.

  20. #20 by shaolin on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 5:20 pm

    Quote:’AAB is angry…’ Has he got the RIGHT to be angry??

    He is practising APRTHEID POLICY in Malaysia..!! Has he
    still got the cheek to be angry..??!!

    Race Harassment,Suppression and Oppression is hustling
    Not only The Indians, But All The Minority Groups living in

    Does Malaysia Government has the cheek and All Good
    Reasons to stage another MAY 13…??!! The World WILL
    make the Judgement, NOT MALAYSIA..!!

    We need All Grass Root support from All Races to over-
    throw the Government. It is BAD Governance..!! A Big
    Hassle breaks out due to MISMANAGEMENT at last
    week’s peaceful street walk intended by thousands of

    What Wrong, offences and Crimes have they committed
    in the first place?? They are all peace loving citizens..!!

  21. #21 by kwkean on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 5:27 pm

    As expected from our ZZzzZZZz ABB, more wayang kulit!! With so many tension going on before the general election, he started to scare that his ‘Feel Good’ mood will no longer reach his supporter in the rural (kampung) area. As we know UMNO gain theirs seat mostly from the rural area, so he just need to perform some wayang kulit to entertain his supporter just to get more votes.

    You think he will do something for the Indian? Believe me, after the election, they will marginalize the Indian even more then before as a pay back for what Hindraf had done. More temple will be tear down and more Indian will be fire from the government department to make way for his supporter. If you think I’m talking bullshit here and spreading nonsense here, think about it again!! If he really want to help the Indian, he would have do so from the beginning rather then cursing Hindraf, using ISA as a treat and dragging this issue.

    So to my brothers and sisters, please keep this mood up till the election and vote them out! ENOUGH IS ENOUGH, I don’t need a useless and racist government.

  22. #22 by sec on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 5:35 pm

    The Hindraf started the “revolution” , now the Chindraf get ready to vote out the BN in the coming election.

  23. #23 by malaysiatoday.com on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 6:03 pm

    Some local Muslims are overacting when something like “Muslim terrorists” appear in the Hindraf memorandum.

    Terrorist is not the copyright of Muslims. Let’s take Sri Lanka’s civil war for example, I had stayed there in late 90s and “experienced” several bombing suicide attacks by Tamil Tigers which killed few hundreds innocent people in a split of second.

    Are we simply say that Tamil Hindus are terrorists because of suicide bombings on Singhalese people by Tamil Tiger?

    The memorandum has never generalized ALL Muslims in Malaysia are terrorists unless UMNO wishes to twist it to their own political advantage. Of course spraying oil to a fire can backfire this country into anarchic state.

    But let’s accept a fact that there is a small pocket of extremists in any religion, whether in Islam, Hindu, Christian, Buddhist and Judaism. The real dangerous is majority of moderate people are easily influenced by extremists’ views and start think irrationally against other race and religion.

    A real test on our faith is how well we always think and act as a religious person and hold our basic principle under the extreme circumstances. This is a real challenge faces by PM Abdullah Ahmad Badawi.

  24. #24 by malaysiatoday.com on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 6:04 pm

    Hindraf letter to British PM may sound radical and seditious. I also disagree with some harsh wordings in the letter.

    BUT this letter does not change some facts long denied by UMNO led government.

    1. Malaysia Indians especially Tamils are marginalized and Indian estate workers’ economic plights are even worst than foreign workers.

    2. UMNO-led government implemented STPM and matriculation dual examination to discriminate under privileged Indians and other non-bumis as well from local universities.

    3. Hindu religion was insulted by insensitive local authourities. Corpse rigging in Syariah court also hurting their feelings.

    4. Poor Indians are not benefiting from NEP which suppose to eradicate poverty irrespective of race and skin color.

    5. Public inquiry on Kampong Medan incident was denied.

    Many more….

    Sri Lanka is a mirror of Malaysia in terms of language, education, affirmative action policies on the majority, etc. Hindu and muslim minorities in Sri Lanka both feel discriminated in public job, public universities, army and police by the Singhalese.

  25. #25 by sj on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 6:11 pm

    So much for having a big ear to listen.

  26. #26 by nckeat88 on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 6:20 pm

    LKS, you have no ‘priciple’. You oppose anything because you are oppose opposition leader. You do not agree with the memorandum, but you choose not to critise the hindraf and support them because they helps you in your political agenda.

    I supported BERSIH because it brings all 3 races together but hindraf is a racist organization putting hatred in 30000 protesters to go against the government specificly and Malay generally. The police for once did a good job otherwise we would have another major racial riot. We should have more of BERSIH movement but put all those hindraf lawyers under ISA. They chose to insult our King by going overseas. They don’t mind a lose-lose strategy provided the government is a bigger loser and at the end of the day they will make us all losers.

  27. #27 by boh-liao on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 6:52 pm

    AAB and Umno should be happy – Malaysia is global and in the news (TIME, Vol. 170, No. 23, December 10, 2007).

    Malaysia’s Identity Crisis

  28. #28 by izrafeil on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 7:18 pm

    its a pretty serious allegation brought up by Hindraff,… over 100 got slashed Kg Medan? I know there is always two side of a story! if this is found not true, then the allegation is of disservice to the Indian community, lets get to the root of the problem, lets check the NRD (national registration department) and see how many actually perished during the said period, this will clear up the issue.

  29. #29 by benny on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 8:22 pm

    Why in earth this PM dont understand the reason of this hindraf rally or he just diverting the whole issue.This is the time for the umno leadership sit and discuss with the representive of tamilians =HINDRAF.Most of the indians dont except MIC AS THEIR REP.SO UMNO AND THE LEADERSHIP USE YOUR BRAIN AND DO SOMETHING FOR THAT COMMUNITY.

  30. #30 by wits0 on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 8:22 pm

    “AAB is spiritually bankrupt”

    He’s only the front man for such a hypocritical system and in many ways he’s also not his own man. So how on earth could his previous words ever be taken for granted? Many have been had and are now awakening to the reality of a pernicious system behind everything.

    No way again can Bolehland again slip below the International radar screen as before. At least this watershed part of it is certain, the visibility is established. People like Ali RustStump is unwittingly helping strongly to display openly the case of Bolehland’s fascist racism.

  31. #31 by motai on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 8:49 pm

    UMNO Sendiri Lahir Dari Perhimpunan Haram
    Tarikh : Sunday, December 02 @ 19:48:58 MYT
    Topik : Artikel

    Oleh Dr Lo’lo’ bt Hj Mohd Ghazali

    Perhimpunan2 menentang Malayan_Union adalah menjadi penyebab kepada lahirnya UMNO. Sejarah telah merakamkan bahawa setelah orang Melayu keluar beramai-ramai dan berdemonstrasi menentang Malayan_Union, mereka telah berkumpul dan menubuhkan UMNO.Sekiranya orang Melayu pada masa itu menunggu permit polis dari Kerajaan British nescaya Malayan_Union tidak dapat dihalang dan UMNO tidak akan wujud.Malaya akan tetap dibawah British. Jadi demo dan himpunan rakyat untuk menyatakan ketidk puasan hati adalah budaya kita sejak dulu, budaya UMNO,budaya PAS, budaya NGO dan sebahagiaan mereka yang berprinsip dan bangun mewakili rakyaat majoriti.

    Mengapa UMNO dengan tiada segan dan silu kerap kali mengungkapkan perkataan Perhimpunan Haram bagi melabel tindakan rakyat Malaysia berhimpun dan menyatakan sikap mereka? Adakah UMNO “mengata dulang paku serpih”? Sedangkan sudah berapa kali UMNO,MCA dll NGO berdemo atas isu antarabangsa serta tempatan Malah dalam filem Hati Malaya yang saya tonton video klip promosinya, dipaparkan sejarah rakyat yang celik dan berani bangun menentang kezaliman penjajah. Yang tidak mahu berdemo selain kerana keuzuran adalah mereka dari golongan pengampu,penakut dan dayus

    Malah di Kelantan himpunan anjuran UMNO didalangi Annuar Musa dalam percubaan UMNO untuk menabal sultan lain selain dari Sultan Kelantan yang ada sekarang. Mengapa UMNO boleh melakukannya sedang orang lain tidak? Jangan buat2 lupa. Himpunan rakyat mencerminkn masyarakat madani. Kini dua hero rakyat lahir dari kegelapan UMNO/BN . Hero dari Parlimen Cameron Highland YB S.K.Devamany dan YB dari Penang. Mereka sekurang2nya meminta pimpinan UMNO/BN melihat dan mengkaji mesej yang dihantar oleh para pen ‘demo’ dan rakyat yang berhimpun, bukat mengugut.

    Peristiwa 1946 dibahasa di DUN Kelantan

    Hujjah tentang demo dan himpunan menentang British di atas ini juga digunapakai oleh YB Nasaruddin Daud dalam Perbahasan Titah Sultan dalam Sidang Dewan Undangan Negeri Kelatan baru-baru ini. Ia telah menyebabkan wakil-wakil rakyat UMNO seperti terkejut (sebab menafikan sejarah). Itulah sikap hipokrit dan tidak cerdiknya mereka. Berbagai-bagai alasan tidak cerdik telah cuba digunakan oleh wakil-wakil rakyat UMNO bagi membenarkan sikap “double standard” mereka.. Tidak hairanlah juga antara mereka ada seorang YB yang masih tidak cukup umur dan cukup akal. Masih duduk dalaam khayalan zaman kanak2 dimana kaki dan tangan jadi senjata bila kalah berhujah. Kesian, YB itu patut masuk PASTI untuk mula balik belajar akhlak dan kemahiran bertolak ansur.

    Hujjah yang mengatakan Perhimpunan 1946 bukan perhimpunan haram kerana waktu itu tiada undang undang adalah dangkal dan buta sejarah. Mana ada negara yang tiada undang2 meskipun dijajah. Jika British menjajah, undang2 yang digunapakai adalah undang-undang British,jika pada zaman Jepun, undang2nya undang2 Jepun. Jepun lagi keras,kejam dan tidak bertolak ansur, tapi datok nenek kita dulu bangun berdemo dan berhimpun ramai2 untuk nyatakan perasaan. Kerana apa? Kerana penjajah atau pemerintah yang ada tidak mendengar dan menafikan keluhan daan ketidak puasan hati rakyat.

    Hujjah yang menyatakan Demonstrasi sekarang ini tidak dibenarkan kerana ianya membawa kepada keganasan juga tidak berpijak dibumi nyata. Kalau sejarah 13 Mei yang dijadikan sandaran, ramai orang sudah tahu fakta sejarah bahawa yang menyebabkan peristiwa 13 Mei adalah kerana provokasi melampau dari penyokong2 UMNO dan faktor ketidak adilan sosial daan ekonomi padaa masa tersebut. Selepas itu ’Bloody Sunday” yang terkenal, mereka yang cedera parah adalah para demonstran kerana campur tangan dan provokasi polis. Bayangkan rakan2 antara bangsa saya rasa sangat kelakar bila ada demonstran yaang dikasari kerana demonstrasi membantah kenaikan harga barang. Tak logik betul polis Malaysia ni. Peristiwa Batu Burok pula bukan program demo tetapi ceramah di laman rumah individu yg tak perlu permit. Berpuluh kali dah ceramah diadakan disitu tanpa sebarang insiden. Jelas kepada kita baahwah demo dan perhimpunan menjadi ganas hanya apabila berlaku campur tangan serta tindakan biadap pihak polis terhadap ahli perkumpulan. Apabila tiada campur tangang pihak polis, semua perhimpunan tersebut menjadi aman.

    Hujjah seterusnya,Perhimpunan tersebut menjadi haram kerana tiada permit ( yakni bertentangan dengan undang-undang negara). Ia tiada permit kerana UMNO/BN tidak mahu memberi permit tanpa alasan yang kukuh. Hanya kerana perhimpunan-perhimpunan ini merugikan UMNO dari segi politik sahaja dan ia juga mendedahkan kebobrokan, kepincangan dan kemungkaran UMNO dan BN kepada rakyat. PM Malaysia pun sama, dia hanya mahu dengar yang muluk2 sahaja. Tutup mata, tutup telinga. Yang dia dengar cakap menantu, anak dan menteri penyangak macam Nazri tu. Cuba sekali bagi permit, misalnya untuk himpunan bersih di negeri2, kami akan buktikan kemahiran kami mengawal ahli dan penyokong2 kami dengan syaarat tiada provokasi SB yaang terancang.

    Salah seorang pimpinan UMNO mengatakan bahawa perhimpunan Bersih itu adalah anjuran parti politik dan bukannya anjuran rakyat Malaysia. Adakah ahli dan penyokong parti pembangkang ini bukan rakyat Malaysia? Ada pula yang cabul mulut menyatakan tiada siapa yang akan keluar ramai2, ada yang kata 2,3 puluh ribu pendemonstran tidaak mewakili rakyat. Cuba baca tulisan Zainul Arifin (NST 28 Nov muka 13). Jika berpuluh ribu boleh digerakkan untuk turun kejalan raya, apalagi beratus ribu, boleh dikatakan dengan yakin bahawa jumlah ini sebenarnya mewakili beberapa kali lipat. ”The silent majority” yang sering disebut2 sebenarnya duduk kem mana? Keputusan pilihanraya membuktikan sokongan kepada BN? Itulah yang Bersih pertikaikan.

    Harus diingat bahawa permit diberikan oleh Polis manakala Polis diletakkan di bawah Kementerian Dalam Negeri yang dikawal oleh UMNO/BN. Sekiranya pihak polis menolak permit mana-mana pihak bererti ianya adalah penolakan dari UMNO/BN.

    Polis Adalah Alat Barisan Nasional Untuk Terus Berkuasa

    Pihak Polis di Malaysia tidak lebih dari biro di dalam UMNO bertanggung-jawab mengekalkan kuasa Barisan Nasional di Malaysia. Mereka hanya mengikut arahan UMNO dan bertindak dengan begitu rakus menggagalkan sesiapa sahaja yang dikhuatiri merugikan Barisan Nasional. Ini dibuktikan dalam soal siasat terhadap tahanan2 ISA. Yang ditanyakan soalan2 politik dan pimpinan politik parti2 selain BN, soalan2 tentang keselamatan negara langsung tidak popular.

    Pihak Polis lebih sanggup menjalankan sekatan-sekatan jalanraya di dalam usaha menggagalkan perhimpunan rakyat berhari2 dari berusaha mencegah jenayah. Tidak pernah lagi kita dengar polis menyuraikan himpunan Mat Rempit yang menDi kala rakyat Malaysia hidup dalam ketakutan angkara penjenayah serta perogol. Sampai sekarang pembunuh kejam Nurin belum ditangkap. Devamany budak India 9 tahun pula jadi mangsa. Mengapa tak kerah seluruh kekuatan polis untuk menangani jenayah yang makin menggerunkan?? Polis sanggup menumpukan tenaga dan usaha mereka ke arah menjayakan agenda politik Barisan Nasional, tapi tidak bersungguh untuk jaga keselamatan rakyat.. Jelas kepada kita bahawa Polis Diraja Malaysia sudah hilang komitment mereka kepada rakyat Malaysia. Biarlah perogol adik Nurin terus menerus memangsa kanak-kanak, tidak apa asalkan tugas mereka menjaga kepentingan Barisan Nasional dan UMNO tidak terhalang.


    Kasihan rakyat Malaysia seolah-olah tiada tempat lagi untuk berteduh dan berlindung. Kerajaan dan pihak berkuasa hanya mahu melindungi kepentingan dan kekayaan beberapa kerat kroni dan UMNO Putra dan rakyat terpaksa bersusah payah dan menderita. Apabila rakyat bersuara tidak puas hati, Polis digunakan untuk bertindak kasar dan zalim kepada rakyat. Media pun sama, sanggup jadi pelacur murah yang melacurkan habis etika kewartawanan mereka.

    40% pegawai atasan boleh didakwa keranaa hidup mewah melebihi pendapatan, perlantikan hakim yang diatur melalui panggilan talipon, pesalah rasuah yang masih bergelar YB dalaam DUN dan Parlimen, Jenaayah yang masuh dalam rumaah dan kejiraanan kita, harga baraang dan sara hidup yang berlipat kali ganda naik, bangunan yang bocor dan runtuh. Rumah, masjid, surau, kuil rakyat yang diroboh pihak penguasa atas nama pembangunan.

    Saya tidak tahu bagaimanakah nasib anak-cucu serta keturunan saya selepas ini jika UMNO/BN terus menipu, memerintah dan menghancurkan Msia. Sekarang rakyat kena cepat bertindak dan lakukan apa yang betul bukan ikut nafsu yang hanya pentingkan keselesaan diri dan keluarga masing2 sahaja. Ramai yang perlukan pembelaan anda.

    Dr Lo’lo’ bt Hj Mohd Ghazali
    AJK PAS Pusat


    Diterbitkan oleh :
    Lajnah IT, DPP Kawasan Dungun, Terengganu
    Email : [email protected] atau : [email protected]
    Pandangan dalam laman ini tidak semestinya menunjukkan sikap DPPKD
    (Dewan Pemuda Pas Kawasan Dungun, Terengganu)

    This article comes from TranungKite Online v7.0
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  32. #32 by max2811 on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 8:50 pm

    The Selangor MB just said on TV that he practically camped in Kg Medan during the Indian/Malay incident to oversee things. (deleted)
    No prejudice? No discrimination? No marginalisation?
    Both my children has straight As in SPM and STP. No scholarships, no medical course, no pharmacy course, no law course. Sorry, all critical courses are 90% reserved for bumis irrespective if they are good enough or not.

  33. #33 by motai on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 8:54 pm

    The time for action is now. We may never have a better chance to reverse the progressive loss of our rights and freedoms for which generations of our forefathers fought and died.

  34. #34 by shaolin on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 8:58 pm

    ‘Spiritually Bankrupt’ AAB, Uncivilized kris-wielding
    Sakai Chief and Barbarian Head, Hishammuddin…

    Are you still searching for good reasons to stage
    another MAY 13 Race Riot and Massacre…??!!! Have
    you still got the cheeks to do that…??!! The Whole
    World is now looking at your potential actions now…

    Just do it now and see what will happen to Malaysia!!!

  35. #35 by EddieTheHead on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 9:01 pm


    What is a “priciple” already? Sheesh, I nearly killed myself trying to figure out what it meant, FFS!

    Hindraf, Rock On!

  36. #36 by Colonel on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 9:13 pm

    “….and the procession was not to teh Malaysian government but to speak to teh British.” hutchrun

    But I thought the procession was to “attract international opinion and embarrass the Malaysian government”?

    “So India has teh fight to speak up on the behalf of these Indian who have sacrificed all for this country , since no one else cares.” hutchrun

    The New Delhi based Indian government has the right to speak up on any international issue but this being a domestic issue and does not involve Indian nationals but nationals of another sovereign state, it might defeat the purpose as far as Malaysian Indians are concerned. It helps to fuel the suspicion that Indians could never be trusted as their loyalty lies not with Malaysia – but with another sovereign state i.e. India or Britain.

    The Indian government and Hindu fundamentalists have ignored their Hindu brothers and sisters in neighbouring Bangladesh. They later fought the Tamil Tigers when it was expedient for them to do so, who were seeking independence from the government of Sri Lanka. They are guilty of marginalizing their own ethnic minorities. Sikhs were discriminated against.

    “…Idiots, ungrateful idiots, this government is , you have forgoten who worked to jumstart Malayas economy..” hutchrun

    But the Malays say they would rather see the country remain underdeveloped and lagging in economic development if that means having control of their country. When the British opened the floodgates to cheap labour from China and India, the Malays were not consulted. Foreign cheap labour was imported to work the tin mines so that tin could be exported back to their country, to work the rubber plantations so that rubber could be exported and to work the railways so that tin and rubber could be transported to ports and be shipped back. Through an indentured system of labour, Indians from South India had their voyages paid for and were contracted to work the rubber estates owned by the British. Flooding colonial Malaya with immigrants destroyed the easy going life style of the rural Malays who were farmers and fishermen who lived off the land like their forefathers for generations.

    These are facts you conveniently left out, my friend.

    “..my father fought with teh British, against teh japanese and later teh Communist” hutchrun

    The Indians were subjects of the British in India. They were recruited into the British Army and paid to fight for the British Crown. Units of the Indian Army were deployed to fight in Malaya to defend the Empire against the Japanese. When these Indians fought they fought for the British Crown and when they worked they did so for themselves.

    These Indians were different from those Indian labourers from south India, recruited to work the rubber plantations and the railways. The HINDRAFT demonstrators were mostly descendants of these Tamil hindus – not the former, not the professionals and the middle class that came after Malaya became independent.

  37. #37 by mycuntree on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 9:39 pm

    It is really very sad that the govt. continue to deny that there is discrimination in the way they are running our beloved country; only that they called it the NEP.It is even sadder that the stated intention and reality of the NEP is in variance. The actual beneficiaries remain the select few. I do not fully blame the current administration for the above, it is the previous administration that must bare the blame, as it has, for more than 2 decades, been fully responsible for its implementation and abuses.

    Let’s pray that the current govt. will wake up to the fact that the current situation cannot, and should not continue, for otherwise it is no different from its predecessor. And that’s a crime.

    From my perspective, it is without doubt the common Indians who presently bare the full blunt of the govt. policy, in respect to opportunites, in education,job and business.

    In term of faith, the egoistic and nationalistic sect has basically hijack the rights of the other faiths to practise theirs in peace and quiet. That’s obvious for all to see.

    The current group of MIC and MCA politicians are quite impotent when they are faced with these situation.The awful and frustrating fact is that they continue to deny that these things are happening; that all is under control and that things will improve.Apparently they have not!.It seems to have gotten worse.

    As is rightly put, the Hindraf protest is a ” CRY OF DESPERATION ‘ by the disadvantaged Indian community. The Indians have been like a cat pushed into a corner, and the only way out is to go forward.Their current political and business “representatives” has completely failed them. They have been forced to seek ” out of the box” solution for their predicament, and they cannot be faulted for that.Desperation requires desperate solutions.

    Unless and until the goverment recognises the frustrations of its people, whether they are Malays, Indians, Chinese or its other minorities this beloved country of ours will be faced with more rough rides in the coming months and years.

    If for 50 years, the same political parties that held the goverment of this rich and beautiful country cannot deliver to its citizens, even their basic wants, then it is time its citizenry must do an Aussie election o its next opportunity. That is the least that YOU can do for yourself. It’s up to you.

  38. #38 by Rocky on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 9:39 pm

    may 13th will not happen as long as UMNO doesn’t allow it to happen. Look back at history and tell me who started May 13th. Will the govt dare make public the report on May 13th.

    ethnic cleansing no lah, marginalised Indians yes!!! cleansing in the civil service..well you can debate about it but clearly civil service now is unlike in 1970s and doesn’t reflect truly Asia Malaysia.

    PM needs to focus on fixing the issues brought up by the Indians instead of diverting the issue to ethnic cleansing. as for taking away citizenship, well do that Rustam and see what kind of backlash you will get. Go try it.

  39. #39 by DarkHorse on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 9:39 pm

    Amidst all this uproar as to why was there a need to refer the matter to the Queen of England and all, we forget the real motive of this Moorthy guy. His motive is suspect. It looks like he is setting up grounds for his application for political asylum in the U.K.

  40. #40 by DarkHorse on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 9:43 pm

    As for Anwar going to India and working on the issue of Indian marginalization with the Indian government and telling them it was their right to interfere, this means his climb to regain his credibility is going to be long and hard if he succeeds at all.

  41. #41 by yapchongyee on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 9:47 pm


    It is true that I am an Australian and it is equally true to say that I am a proud Australian; but why should I not be ? Australia is the best place to live because contrary to what lot of nonsense that prevails in Malaysia, Australia is not racist, unlike Malaysia. I was a Malaysian until 1978 when I migrated to Australia. I wanted a homeland that was free of racism; totally disgusted with what misery that pass for democracy, “MERITOCRACY”, whatever else that you Malays care to spin and claim as a Malaysia that is modern because you are not first world, you are bloody 3rd rate & 3rd world, lah !

    I do not obviously claim to have any positive sentiments for Malaysia, and I do not claim even to want to see a Malaysia that will progress towards a decent, morally upright civil society, because Malaysia is in truth an OLIGARCHY; which is described as government by “the few”. UMNO is not a Malay political party, because UMNO does not serve the Malay people; UMNO is only a political instrument to mislead the Rakyat to support the OLIGARCH; and who are the oligarch ? Look at the leadership of UMNO ! They are the sons & daughters of the original UMNO, the syed Albar, the Tun Husseins, the Tun Razaks, the Syed Albars and etc. These are oligarchs who live by their lies and keep the Malay rakyats in perpetual serfdom. The ordinary rakyat does not share in the fruits of the nation. What has the 50 years of Merdeka produced for the Malays ? Everything the same, lah ! Grinding poverty, perpetual debt, and this time do not blame the middle men, CHINESE as you are prome to do. The grinding poverty of the Malay rakyat is perpetuated by your so called “NEW ECONOMIC POLICY”. In truth you do take away from the Chinese & the Indians, but to be sure, you do not give it to the Malay rakyat, BUT YOU GIVE IT TO YOURSELF, THE OLIGARCH. The sons cousins, brothers of Tun Husseins, the Mahatirs, the Syed Albars etc.

    Has the New Economic Policy lifted the general conditions of the Malay rakyats ?
    NO ! Let me reveal the truth; why do I say that the rakyat does not get a “look in” to the benefits of Malaysia’s development if indeed there si any whatsoever. I read on the website of “the Malaysian Bar”, discussing the causes of the recent “HINDRAFF” that Malays hold 20% of the total shares, Indians 2% and Chinese 40%. I take these figures as merely hypothetical; however it is a starting point. I take the figure for the Malays of 20% for the sake of argument, therefore to get at the truth we need to ask ourselves, “HOW ARE THE 20% TO BE DEFINED ?” This forms the crux of the issue, because we can then see who and how the shares are held and from that we can say for sure whether the 20% is in truth held by the rakyat. Let me say it as the truth, because NOBODY IN MALAYSIA WILL DARE TO SAY AS IT IS. These 20% stake of the Malay share of the economic pie are in fact held by GOVERNMENT OWNED CORPORATION, as for example, “FELDA” “MALAYSIA AIRLINES” “SIME DARBY”; to the Malaysian Government and the Malays, these are deemed to be Malay. These are Malaysian Government Corporation and they are not really Malay owned at all. They are as much Chinese, Indians, or whatever owned as they are Malay owned, because the funds that purchased them come from the MALAYSIAN GOVERNMENT, and the Indians & Chinese are as much Malaysians as the Malays. This very crucial definition has been passed over because if the issue is raised the Malays threaten to take to rioting like in 1969.

    I praise HINDRAFF, the truly representative party for the Indians. The MIC is not representative of the Indians because it only makes their leaders very rich (1 or 2 maybe, and you know who). It is time that the Chinese too organize themselves into another Chinese version of the HINDRAFF. You cannot expect the Malay oligarch to deliver into Chinese laps reforms that will take away their golden goose; you will need to agitate for reforms as the Indians have so courageously dared to demand their fair share of the economic pie.

    I would like to observe that our Chinese people are gutless. There is forever only one weapon for change and that is to PUT PRESSURE ON THE GOVERNMENT; and the only pressure that will cause pain for the government is to shut down the economy by civil disobedience; learn from “Ghandigi”, take to the streets. Chinese must join with HINDRAFF and break away from the MCA; they are like the MIC, theyr look after themselves.

  42. #42 by Godamn Singh on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 9:50 pm

    Some say the last few months have been good politically for this Anwar but I beg to differ. I think he has ended up alienating the fence-sitters among the Malays.

    Yes, credibility will continue to be the issue with him. Remember, Anwar was responsible for unleashing Islamic fundamentalism when he was with PAS and later personally recruited by Mahathir and though his views had moderated, he did not stem the tide but was responsible for the Islamizatioin of the country’s institutions. He must take some of the blame for the Indians continuing to be marginalized.

  43. #43 by malaysiatoday.com on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 9:56 pm

    DarkHorse Says:

    December 2nd, 2007 at 21: 43.13
    As for Anwar going to India and working on the issue of Indian marginalization with the Indian government and telling them it was their right to interfere, this means his climb to regain his credibility is going to be long and hard if he succeeds at all.


    When Anwar told you he went to India? You got it from UMNO TV3 or Utusan?

    UMNO misinformation campaign does not work in the cyberworld because Malaysian netizens are not typical brainless orang kapmpong.

  44. #44 by Godamn Singh on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 10:06 pm

    Cool it pal! An NDTV correspondent wrote about the visit. Go read and come back and tell us!

  45. #45 by jigsawpuzzle on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 10:06 pm

    If Malaysia can interfere with our faith…though breaking down temples, messing around with converted cases (revathi, lina joy, mountain climber guy and thousand others), what is this called?

    ok ethnic cleansing is harsh….but what do u call this? minority trampling???
    yes thats what it is……MINORITY TRAMPLING.

  46. #46 by DiaperHead on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 10:15 pm

    You calling orang kampong “brainless”?? Anwar is making a big mistake if he thinks like you.

    Already he is making his first major mistake by going to Mumbai, India to give his support for the HINDRAF demonstrators and to call for Indian intervention. No matter how they spin it that is how it looks to his “brainless” orang kampong. Do not underestimate the efficacy of the local grapevine – it is around long before the internet.

    Or has he forgotten that he needed to tell HINDRAF not to demand for the ending of Article 153?

  47. #47 by dawsheng on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 10:19 pm

    Ethnic cleansing refers to various policies or practices aimed at the displacement of an ethnic group from a particular territory in order to create a supposedly ethnically “pure” society. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnic_cleansing

    “Abdullah even offered to resign if there was proof that the Government was involved in ethnic cleansing.” http://thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?file=/2007/12/2/nation/19641408&sec=nation&focus=1

    What we need is not proof, what we have is living examples.

  48. #48 by wtf2 on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 10:31 pm


  49. #49 by dawsheng on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 10:34 pm

    Umno vice-president Datuk Seri Mohd Ali Rustam has rebuked Hindu Rights Action Force (Hindraf) leaders for their “outrageous actions” and urged the Government to revoke their citizenship. “They are going to send their memorandum to India, Britain and even the United Nations. These people are betraying their own country,” he added. http://thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?file=/2007/12/2/nation/19642424&sec=nation

    Their country had betrayed them, can they then revoke UMNO leaders and the MIC’s citizenship? The “outrageous actions” were not committed by Hindraf’s leaders but by Pro-UMNO Islamic radicals who demolished Indian temples through out Malaysia, fully backed by UMNO, MIC and MCA just kep quiet. Sending memo is definitely better way than seeing fireworks, Mr Ali Rustam.

  50. #50 by HJ Angus on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 10:52 pm

    It looks as if the PM has a big mouth rather than big ears.

    Anyway we need a PM who has a big brain and a brave heart to deal with people like the Malacca CM.

  51. #51 by pulau_sibu on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 10:53 pm

    The higher education minister must be relieved recently because of this incident, else uncle lim has been after him about the ranking. he must be appreciating the hindraf demonstration

  52. #52 by chgchksg128 on Sunday, 2 December 2007 - 11:09 pm

    Bangkok Post has an article for racial issue

  53. #53 by bashaa_manick on Monday, 3 December 2007 - 12:01 am

    Definitions of ethnic cleansing

    The term ethnic cleansing has been variously defined. In the many words of Andrew Bell-Fialkoff:

    [E]thnic cleansing […] defies easy definition. At one end it is virtually indistinguishable from forced emigration and population exchange while at the other it merges with deportation and genocide. At the most general level, however, ethnic cleansing can be understood as the expulsion of an “undesirable” population from a given territory due to religious or ethnic discrimination, political, strategic or ideological considerations, or a combination of these.[2]
    Drazen Petrovic has distinguished between broad and narrow definitions. Broader definitions focus on the fact of expulsion based on ethnic criteria, while narrower definitions include additional criteria: for example, that expulsions are systematic, illegal, involve gross human-rights abuses, or are connected with an ongoing internal or international war. According to Petrovic:

    [E]thnic cleansing is a well-defined policy of a particular group of persons to systematically eliminate another group from a given territory on the basis of religious, ethnic or national origin. Such a policy involves violence and is very often connected with military operations. It is to be achieved by all possible means, from discrimination to extermination, and entails violations of human rights and international humanitarian law.”[3]
    The official United Nations definition of ethnic cleansing is “rendering an area ethnically homogeneous by using force or intimidation to remove from a given area persons of another ethnic or religious group”[4]

    However, ethnic cleansing rarely aims at complete ethnic homogeneity. The common practice is the removal of stigmatized ethnic groups, and thus can be defined as “the forcible removal of an ethnically defined population from a given territory”, occupying the middle part of a somewhat fuzzy continuum between nonviolet pressured ethnic emigration and genocide.[5]

  54. #54 by budak on Monday, 3 December 2007 - 12:09 am


  55. #55 by calvinboy on Monday, 3 December 2007 - 2:00 am

    This a reality of Malaysia….”DEMOCRATIC” country…i don’t think so…..All the media just say how good the govenment is…but the bad thing they are hiding from peoples..i think the next election the BN will see the big impact…The stupid UMNO youth leader just say stupid words…actually he just know how to say and protect his man ..how about others?.Do he care….That why until now Malaysia can’t compete with singapore….Bad image are created to the world now..Therefore,more and more non-malay i likely to migrate to other country..

  56. #56 by Jeffrey on Monday, 3 December 2007 - 2:42 am

    The Hindraf assembly was an illegal assembly. The Hindraf memorandum to the British Prime Minister, Gordon Brown contains exaggeration of ethnic cleansing which exposes its authors to the charge of sedition, or worse still the ISA under domestic law. Appealing to UK and Indian governments expose them to charges of being disloyal to their own country with Rustam Ali demanding a revocation of their citizenship. On top of that they would be mindful that racial discrimination in general and marginalisation of Tamil Hindu in particular would generally be considered a domestic issue in relation to which other countries would normally not interfere by international law and norm. Yet they went against these odds.

    The Hindraf leaders are, by majority, lawyers. They ought to know the law, whether domestic or international. Indeed they know it but chose to disregard abiding by it. Why?

    Increasingly, it is becoming clear, that whilst taking huge risks, they have a daring but coherent plan.

    They are smart to know that the crux of the problem here is the prevailing political architecture of racial cum religious discrimination. And they know that no matter how hard one tries to dismantle this architecture by traditional means of the ballot box, civil discourse and abiding by the law, it will be an exercise in futility.

    The plan from day one is to throw a red herring in filing a mega RM27.7 trillion suit against the ex Colonial power (that has no hope of winning), mobilize a demonstration, exaggerate the extent of Hindu Tamil’s persecution for the greater objective of riveting international attention to the architecture of racial cum religious discrimination in Malaysia, galvanizing international support for their cause, and principally subjecting the government to international scrutiny of its national discriminatory policies in the hope of bringing to bear unto the Malaysian government international pressure and moral opinion to dismantle what must be the last legalized bastion of Apartheid in the world after South Africa.

    It is as if to say since domestic pressure does not evince the remotest chance to make the government change its stance, why not try, for a change, international pressure by spotlighting Malaysia’s inequitable policies to world’s scrutiny and attention?

    Already Indian Prime Minister Manmohan Singh said New Delhi would take up issue with KL; Waythamoorthy’would meet US State Department Malaysia desk officers, congresspersons, senators and human rights group;one or two Labour Party parliamentarians are likely taking up issue to ask our government to stop the demolishment of temples. Where would it lead to?

    Of course the ruling elites are angry. They are because the strategy is working.

    Pressure will be exerted if the plan works smoothly. How could, for example, government leaders posture with liberty to lecture Myanmar junta generals on democratization when their own backyard has the same problem?

    The very life blood of crony capitalistic system upon which politicians feed here for sustenance is investment and business which will be subject to all kinds of risks (the worst being sanctions, though I am not suggesting it is anywhere near there at this moment) if and should international pressure intensifies and gathers momentum!

    It is shrewd calculation that international opinion and moral pressure is also likely their greatest ally should and if the powers-that-be deems it appropriate to incarcerate them for breaking domestic laws.

    To be sure many things can go wrong with this epic and ambitious strategy – a classic non violent strategy, Ghandi style but I shall not dwell at this juncture with these risks.

    Suffice to say, what they try to do – by defining their Cause and Movement on a narrow frame of reference of Tamil Hindu plight for which they have been severely criticized by moderates and liberals as not being sufficiently broad based and inclusive of other oppressed Malaysians – may well prove the strategy that represents most hope for all Malaysians of ever pressuring the powers-that-be make concessions to revise the NEP and tone down the race based aspects thereof.

  57. #57 by malaysiatoday.com on Monday, 3 December 2007 - 4:19 am

    DiaperHead Says:

    December 2nd, 2007 at 22: 15.48
    You calling orang kampong “brainless”?? Anwar is making a big mistake if he thinks like you.

    Already he is making his first major mistake by going to Mumbai, India to give his support for the HINDRAF demonstrators and to call for Indian intervention. No matter how they spin it that is how it looks to his “brainless” orang kampong. Do not underestimate the efficacy of the local grapevine – it is around long before the internet.

    Or has he forgotten that he needed to tell HINDRAF not to demand for the ending of Article 153?


    Spinning doctor to turn “brainless” orang kampong to orang kampong “brainless”. Anyway orang kampong do not need brain to receive UMNO-led government subsidies.

    UMNO is played up a technical mistake of using “ethnic cleasing” in the memorandum to incite Malay hatred feeling against Indians.

    Both Hindarf and UMNO are guilty for inciting racial hatred sentiments.

  58. #58 by malaysiatoday.com on Monday, 3 December 2007 - 4:27 am

    shaolin Says:

    December 2nd, 2007 at 20: 58.03
    ‘Spiritually Bankrupt’ AAB, Uncivilized kris-wielding
    Sakai Chief and Barbarian Head, Hishammuddin…

    Are you still searching for good reasons to stage
    another MAY 13 Race Riot and Massacre…??!!! Have
    you still got the cheeks to do that…??!! The Whole
    World is now looking at your potential actions now…

    Just do it now and see what will happen to Malaysia!!!


    Indonesian government is still free from any prosecution in international court for Jakarta 513 riot even all evidences are circulated in internet for past 10 years.

    The different is India government voiced out their concerns with Malaysia while China communist government remains silence against Indonesia for 98’s 513 riot and Malaysia for 69’s 513 riot.

  59. #59 by lakshy on Monday, 3 December 2007 - 6:26 am

    When one is constipated, one knows what medication or traditional remedies to take to help evacuate the blockage. But one must know where to go to do it. Presumably it is to the toilet bowl. Hence my comment to the kid is to deliver his “sh1t” to the right place.

    There is no need to comment if he has nothing to say or to contribute. Thats what he should learn. Thats also why I refer to hima s being constipated! He probably sees himself coming to your level as he seems to adore you. Or are you the same person using different nicks?

  60. #60 by limkamput on Monday, 3 December 2007 - 6:41 am

    DarkHorse Says: Amidst all this uproar as to why was there a need to refer the matter to the Queen of England and all, we forget the real motive of this Moorthy guy. His motive is suspect. It looks like he is setting up grounds for his application for political asylum in the U.K.

    Stupid (deleted), how dare you insult the Hindraf leaders! They are able to accomplish in one week what the MIC and other opposition parties probably can’t achieve in decades. But then how can I blame you. Your brain is just too puny to hold all variables together and see their ramification.

  61. #61 by limkamput on Monday, 3 December 2007 - 6:48 am

    wtf2 Says: [deleted]

    Sdr Kit,
    In many occasions my postings were deleted and on reflection, I agreed with the step taken. May I know why the posting above is allowed to stand?

    [Valid query. Unless a new system is introduced that all comments are approved first before they are posted on the blog, such an incident as limkamput points out will happen. I hope it is not necessary to consider such a system in order to protect this blog. Can I also urge all posters to respect all other posters and visitors by refraining from using langauge which are crude, vulgar and offensive. – Kit]

  62. #62 by limkamput on Monday, 3 December 2007 - 7:00 am

    Colonel said: …..being a domestic issue and does not involve Indian nationals but nationals of another sovereign state, it might defeat the purpose as far as Malaysian Indians are concerned. It helps to fuel the suspicion that Indians could never be trusted as their loyalty lies not with Malaysia – but with another sovereign state i.e. India or Britain.

    Stupid Colonel, wise up man! Do you know how much of abuse and violation of human rights have been committed in the name of national sovereignty?

    Fuel suspicion that Indians (and Chinese) could never be trusted? Where do you come from, the Moon? Since when are Indians (and Chinese) trusted in anything other than doing business and that also increasingly is being curtailed. You are pathetic. Please go back to my response of your earlier criticism.

  63. #63 by Godamn Singh on Monday, 3 December 2007 - 7:10 am

    So lakshy is limkamput. What’s new?

    Limkampuiiiiiet says “Your brain is just too puny to hold all variables together and see their ramification”.

    Add that to the growing list of one-liners from limkampuuiiiet, and what do you get – if not someone with a problem of controlling his ego, someone who claims to have good control of the English language and others do not, when he doesn’t know the difference between “egoism” and “egotism”.

    Here are the rest of his “Quotable Quotes”:

    “I think the more you write, the more you show your stupidity”

    “We are what we repeatedly do. it is confirmed that you are more than stupid”

    “I suggest you go for grade one english class first before you come here”

    “Colonel my foot. You are not even qualified to be private.”

    These one-liners are made to different commentators. He thinks Jeffrey is using another nick Lee Wang Yen!

    What shall we do with him??

  64. #64 by limkamput on Monday, 3 December 2007 - 7:11 am

    Colonel said: When the British opened the floodgates to cheap labour from China and India, the Malays were not consulted.

    So what are you trying to tell us now? Go back to history and change it? The Malays have lost this country by default, period. If the Malays want to go back to their leisure life of the past, they should have said so during the time of independence. The British then could send the Indians back to India and the Chinese to China or made us British nationals or better still annexed this country like Falkland.

  65. #65 by undergrad2 on Monday, 3 December 2007 - 7:20 am

    Calm down! Have you forgotten to take your medications this morning?

  66. #66 by Jeffrey on Monday, 3 December 2007 - 7:21 am

    The authors of Hindraf memorandum were not interested in its factual accuracies (the part on ‘ethnic cleansing’) because their main agenda was to dramatise the Hindu Tamil plight, bring Malaysia’s architecture of discriminatory policies to the fore of international scrutiny and subject Malaysian government to international pressure to ameliorate if not dismantle them.

    It is all part of a classic non-violent civil disobedient strategy, which began, with a non-starter red herring of a RM27.7 trillion class suit against the ex-colonial government.

    Right or wrong, Hindraf leaders are positioning to portray the country as a kind of last surviving apartheid “rogue” regime violating the principles in the UN Declaration of Human Rights in the hope that like Myanmar it will be subject to international pressure to dismantle the architecture of discriminatory policies.

    The government is furious because the strategy shows a promise of working to an extent as Indian Prime Minister Manmohan Singh said New Delhi would take up the issue with KL via diplomatic channels; US state officials will be seeing one of their leaders, Mr.P.Waythamoorthy and one or two Labour parliamentarians evinced intention to raise the issue with the Gordon Brown’s government.

    With international support being galvanized, Malaysian government leaders will be severely embarrassed if they try to posture on the international stage to lecture other countries like Myanmar on its civil and human rights record.

    Also it is also the very nature of patronage system within the BN to rely on foreign investors’ support to sustain the various infrastructure projects (the various “Corridors”) to sustain and feed it. If the government’s image as observer of basic human rights is dented, it will have negative effect on its capitalistic programs.

    It is striking where it hurts.

    The other advantage of international support is that any attempt to arrest them under ISA or Sedition would elevate their stature towards that of Aung Sang Su Khi’s, at least that’s what they hope.

    Where Hindraf’s agenda may by original terms of reference be restricted to narrow Hindu Tamil’s concerns, and has been criticized by liberals and moderates as exclusive of broader Malaysian concerns, yet what it does – and even if it was executed with scant attention to niceties of legalities – still it represents a glimmer of hope for all Malaysians wishing for the country’s discriminatory architecture to be dismantled, now that international pressure has been canvassed where domestic pressure has so far proven inefficacious.

    Whether the grand strategy would work or back fire with the government’s tightening its grip and ordering a crackdown, remains to be seen.

  67. #67 by dawsheng on Monday, 3 December 2007 - 7:22 am

    Don’t hold any form of street protests now as the move will only stir up uneasiness among the people and harm racial unity in the country, says Information Minister Datuk Seri Zainuddin Maidin. He said street rallies, regardless of whatever reasons given, should not be permitted.


  68. #68 by undergrad2 on Monday, 3 December 2007 - 7:34 am

    What the colonel must have meant to say was that the Malays have as much right as the HINDRAF demonstrators to file a lawsuit. They are not doing it for obvious reasons because they are not the ones marginalized some fifty years later. They were when the British were in control.

    Ethnic minorities being marginalized are a world wide phenomenon and not just peculiar to this country alone. India marginalized its own ethnic minorities and still does. India is as guilty perhaps second only to China and Russia for human rights abuse of its own citizens.

  69. #69 by undergrad2 on Monday, 3 December 2007 - 7:37 am

    “The Malays have lost this country by default, period. ”

    It is statements like this that gets Kit in trouble.

  70. #72 by Jefus on Monday, 3 December 2007 - 8:40 am

    oops, sorry for the double posting – IE is sticky today.

  71. #73 by Jimm on Monday, 3 December 2007 - 9:21 am

    All of us did not and will never lose this country as this country are meant for us.
    It’s BN that is losing their strength here and so much so that they begun to instilled extra fears and gearing additional ‘racial’ political grounds to continue their ‘misleading’ leadership to Malaysian.At this moment, their strategies are working as most Malaysian starting to quiet down and stay away.
    It’s not us that scares …It’s UMNO as their scandals have been exposed by their former members…
    Now, they are roping in the Rulers to safe them as part of the scandals also involved certain parties within.
    The picture is going to be ‘harder’ to digest now..
    They have no choice but to go for the highest authorities to calm things down and put everything back in control.
    Killing a few to save many ‘involved’ parties will be the main objectives.

  72. #74 by Saint on Monday, 3 December 2007 - 9:21 am

    The term “ethnic cleansing” is wrong; but how is Malaysia going to proof it? A commission might bring out more worms. Samy Velu, MIC and their “social groups” are the main problems thus asking then to handle a hot line is worthless.

    Kit why are you not opening a “hot line blog” to receive comments from Indians publicly, compile it and then deliver it to the PM. Would this not be more credible for all of us. You are also the opposition leader for the Indians in the parliament – are you not?

  73. #75 by undergrad2 on Monday, 3 December 2007 - 9:29 am

    US state officials will be seeing one of their leaders, Mr.P.Waythamoorthy …” Jeffrey

    Officials of the Department of State and U.S. Senators are accessible in ways our own are not. The U.S. is interested in seeing Malaysia stable and an ally in their fight against Islamic terrorists. So don’t read too much into it.

    The marginalization of ethnic minorities in Malaysia or anywhere else so long as it does not have U.S. interest in the balance, does not matter to the U.S. Perhaps some junior official in the Department of State dealing with U.S. interests in the region will be asked to issue some kind of statement. It doesn’t hurt anybody to issue a statement. Democratization of regimes leaning towards authoritarianism is always good for the U.S.

  74. #76 by cheng on soo on Monday, 3 December 2007 - 9:57 am

    Right, limkamput, if Malays want to go back to their leisure life of the past, (as claim by some umno supporters now) they should have said so during the time of independence. the umno leaders at 1957, can then ask the British to send the Indians back to India and the Chinese to China or made us British nationals or pajak for another 99 years like HK.
    Leisure life is not something u want u get it easily. so easy meh! leisure life for 50 years n more ?? think properly lah. nos of mouth to feed, same kah? no many anak n cucu, hah? no tv, no internet, no many car, no flush toilet, no many tap water, no many u graduates, no many electricity etc, ok? need many Mat salleh or Jepun for many high tech things? If Chinese n Indian were sent back then, probably Msia today will be dominated by mat salleh n jepun, better kah? ingat betul2 lah!
    Look like present umno leaders cannot agree with their own leaders of 1957 that Indian n Chinese in Malaya were accepted as citizen ! n hence should be treated equally as any other citizen. There is no one country that discriminate more than 35% of its citizen can prosper for long time! sooner or later every citizen will suffer ! at least economically !

  75. #77 by undergrad2 on Monday, 3 December 2007 - 9:59 am


    There is a poster so far who tries to blur the definition of ‘ethnic cleansing’. The best way is not to define but to point to examples of ‘ethnic cleansing’ when you see one. What happened to the Kurds under Saddam Hussein is one. What the Turks did in the First WW and what the U.S. Congress decided to classify it as ‘ethnic cleansing’ is another. What happened in Bosnia more recently is yet another.

    By referring to incidents here in Malaysia involving the Indians as ‘ethnic cleansing’ is to trivialize the serious issue of marginalization.

  76. #78 by Godfather on Monday, 3 December 2007 - 10:34 am

    In today’s STAR, Semi Value asked rhetorically if Malaysian Indians don’t have clothes to wear or food to eat. Is he thinking that we are living in the colonial era ? He completely misses the point about marginalisation, and if the Indians continue to vote for a clown like that, then I really will have no sympathies for them.

  77. #79 by undergrad2 on Monday, 3 December 2007 - 10:38 am

    However, Godfather don’t you think the following characterization of events is rather off the mark??

    “When the minority Tamil population was similarly oppressed in Sri Lanka, they revolted and now the country has descended into a full-fledged civil war, says an editorial in India Daily. It goes on to say, “A similar situation is arising in Malaysia…”

    The Indian government withdrew its support of the Tamil Tigers and the U.S. has classified it as a terrorist organization.

  78. #80 by undergrad2 on Monday, 3 December 2007 - 10:43 am

    …and here’s what Wikipedia got to say about persecution of Hindus:

    “Persecution of Hindus refers to the religious persecution inflicted upon Hindus. Hindus have been historically persecuted during Islamic rule of the Indian subcontinent and during Portuguese rule of Goa. In modern times, Hindus in Kashmir, Pakistan, Bangladesh, Uganda and Fiji have also suffered persecution. Persecution of Hindus during Islamic rule was conducted through massive “ethnic cleansing”, forced religious conversion, enslavement, desecration and demolition of Hindu temples and ashrams.[citation needed] Christian persecution of Hindus in Goa during Portuguese rule, included the defamation of Hinduism through forced conversions, burnings, mass-rapes of Hindu women (and the sexual abuse of Hindu children), lootings, and other violent means. Persecution also extended to the confiscation or destruction of private Hindu property, or the incitement of violence through propaganda.”

  79. #81 by Godfather on Monday, 3 December 2007 - 11:00 am

    The Indian Daily is talking about “oppression”. I think the editors know that there is no full-fledged civil war yet, but they are obviously implying that there could be one.

    In Indian government withdrew its support of the Tamil Tigers, but stood idly by as the Tamilians in Tamil Nadu continued to support the movement financially as well as logistically. As for the US, do you think that its classification of the LTTE as a terrorist organisation has any effect on that organisation ?

  80. #82 by Godfather on Monday, 3 December 2007 - 11:09 am

    If UMNO truly did not oppress the minority races, then they should come out into the open (I liked the “transparency” promise by Badawi 4 years ago) and categorise what they have done for Indians in the past 20 years. Come public with the developments on Maika Holdings and the Telekom shares. Come public on the ACA’s investigations into the wealth of Semi Value and his family members.

    Nah, UMNO won’t do that simply because it would clearly show that they have only thrown crumbs to the Indians and that those crumbs were monopolised by a select few within the MIC. Furthermore, by having Semi Value as UMNO’s enforcer for the leakages from government contracts, there is no chance that Semi would be asked to account for his misdeeds.

  81. #83 by hutchrun on Monday, 3 December 2007 - 11:50 am

    For someone up there who thinks ethnic cleansing only means killing, read this:

    ethnic cleansing [Encyclopædia Britannica Article]

    the attempt to create ethnically homogeneous geographic areas through the deportation or forcible displacement of persons belonging to particular ethnic groups. Ethnic cleansing sometimes involves the removal of all physical vestiges of the targeted group through the destruction of monuments, cemeteries, and houses of worship.

    In that sense Hindraf is right.

  82. #84 by k1980 on Monday, 3 December 2007 - 3:16 pm

    When will we all get to say, “It’s morning again in Malaysia.”

    Morning has broken, like the first morning
    Blackbird has spoken, like the first bird
    Praise for the singing, praise for the morning
    Praise for the springing fresh from the word

    Sweet the rain’s new fall, sunlit from heaven
    Like the first dewfall, on the first grass
    Praise for the sweetness of the wet garden
    Sprung in completeness where his feet pass

    Mine is the sunlight, mine is the morning
    Born of the one light, Eden saw play
    Praise with elation, praise every morning
    God’s recreation of the new day

  83. #85 by lakshy on Monday, 3 December 2007 - 4:08 pm

    We have England and Indian now putting pressure on Malaysian Govt. Good! That would mean that they have a true picture of what happened on 25th Dec.

  84. #86 by Godfather on Monday, 3 December 2007 - 4:55 pm

    Lakshy: It would also mean that they can look into the future. Maybe they have seen that Father Christmas will be very generous with Malaysians this year.

  85. #87 by undergrad2 on Monday, 3 December 2007 - 7:05 pm


    The U.S. government is not naive as to believe that by it classifying an organization terrorist or a regime terrorist it would lead to its demise. It is only the first step towards isolating a regime if that is the case, or the first step in stopping funding to those countries who support it.

    It should not be surprising if India’s withdrawal of support (but events show that India did not always support this organization) for the Tamil Tigers has something to do with the U.S. stance on the issue. The Sri Lankan government is a legitimately elected government but representation is skewed towards the representation of the majority race – the Hindus being an ethnic minority. Correct me if I’m wrong.

    The U.S. classification of organizations as “terrorist” has consequences. One of them is to refuse asylum to individuals seeking it anywhere in the world should they be found to be involved in organizations classified as “terrorist”.

  86. #88 by DarkHorse on Monday, 3 December 2007 - 8:31 pm

    “If the Powers-that-be have their fingers on the pulse of society and are smart, Section 27 of the police Act, which came into being out of the exigencies of May 13 would be scrapped off immediately to remove any doubt whether a rally without police permit is illegal.” EARNEST

    I see you’re still confused over the issue of what is legal and what is not!

    “Whether a rally without police permit is illegal”?

    What should we call a rally or assembly or public demonstrations without a permit if not “illegal”? Isn’t something that goes against the law illegal?? Is there any doubt??

  87. #89 by DarkHorse on Monday, 3 December 2007 - 8:35 pm

    I don’t think we need a Cambridge scholar like Lee Wang Yen to explain to you the difference between “illegal” and “morally wrong” or “unconscionable”. His analogy of the bible smuggling priest is a good enough example.

  88. #90 by Saint on Monday, 3 December 2007 - 8:56 pm

    Dear Undergrad2 – I agreed that the term “ethnic cleansing” was wrong. It did not happen in Malaysia, but there is one or two regrettable instances that the government does not want to investigate and make public the actual story. If somebody, “here Hindraf” wants those cases to be investigated then calling them “ethnic cleansing” is putting the onus on the government to proof it did not happen. Here again the government will keep on harping that “ethnic cleansing” did not happen (which is very true); but will not take steps to investigate and make a report as it will not be good to the BN government. So Hindraf has placed the BN government in an uncomfortable position. This is a bad publicity stun by Hindraf; but then BN is also not a fair player either. Thanks for the comment for I should have been clearer.

  89. #91 by Loh on Monday, 3 December 2007 - 9:46 pm


  90. #92 by Godamn Singh on Monday, 3 December 2007 - 10:08 pm


    Take note Kit’s reply to your objection:

    “Can I also urge all posters to respect all other posters and visitors by refraining from using langauge which are crude, vulgar and offensive. – Kit]”

    Kit is always polite and diplomatic in the use of the English language. I hope the message is not lost on you.

  91. #93 by limkamput on Monday, 3 December 2007 - 10:31 pm

    “The Malays have lost this country by default, period. ”

    It is statements like this that gets Kit in trouble. Undergrad2

    Typical of your spineless character! If you want to debate with me, please come directly to me. There is no need to involve Sdr Kit. What is the problem with my statement? Have you not just heard that the Melaka CM has called or revocation of citizenship of those who want to take the case abroad? Please have some conviction of what you want to say. Otherwise my characterisation of you been intellectually corrupted in my earlier posting was not farfetched.

  92. #94 by limkamput on Monday, 3 December 2007 - 10:54 pm

    DarkHorse said: I don’t think we need a Cambridge scholar like Lee Wang Yen to explain to you the difference between “illegal” and “morally wrong” or “unconscionable”. His analogy of the bible smuggling priest is a good enough example.

    Lee Wang Yen, Lee Wang Yen, Lee Wang Yen, Lee Wang Yen, Lee Wang Yen, Lee Wang Yen, Lee Wang Yen, Lee Wang Yen, Lee Wang Yen, Lee Wang Yen, Lee Wang Yen. Can you not use your puny head to think a bit? Look, the world is not made different by those ivory tower brats. It is made different by people in HINDRAF. Got it? One more thing may be I need to remind an ignorant soul like you is that the world has progressed for hundreds of years without Phd. So stop blindly worshiping all those brats whose only gift is probably just know how to write and argue but in term of practical solution, they have nothing to offer.

    Tell me again the purpose of laboriously trying to explain the concept of being morally right but legally wrong. May be I should widen the debate further: How about doing the right thing wrong? What about doing the wrong things right? I hope it is not too difficult for you. Who need these polemics within the context of HINDRAF and BERSIH demonstrations?

  93. #95 by undergrad2 on Monday, 3 December 2007 - 11:24 pm

    Goddamn Singh,

    It is too much to expect a Cambridge wannabe from Kg. Attap (a red light district) to understand the polite reminder by Kit (above) in reply to his inquiry as to why his post has been deleted.

    After all he’s always referring to the “epitome of…” something or other. He keeps referring to the “epitome of egoism” without understanding the difference between “egoism” and “egotism” and yet he says posters have poor control of English and that he can write better. sheeesh….

  94. #96 by limkamput on Tuesday, 4 December 2007 - 12:16 am

    Kit’s reminder is for ALL blogers. My posting that got deleted was never on those words I used on you all. It was my indiscretion on word choice on issues of the day. You people should also look at how you attacked me simply because I am prepared to stand up against half-baked self centred morons. If not for the respect I cherish for this blog, I would have used even stronger terms on people like Godamn Singh and DarkHorse. As for Undergrad2, let me use another word on you. You are about the most treacherous person I ever met in this blog in which on amount of medication can ever cure you.

    [Let us agree to disagree agreeably. It pains everyone to read the prolonged and protracted exchange of invectives and name-calling. Lets call a halt. Otherwise, posters will have to be put on the moderator list (2) which, as mentioned elsewhere, may take 24 – 48 hours to clear because of time constraints. Can we move on? – Kit]

  95. #97 by lakshy on Tuesday, 4 December 2007 - 5:50 am

    Ha ha, immature maybe, but I dont think treacherous would describe him. He pings and he pongs.

    And if he is an undergraduate, he should not be spending much of his time here. His priority should be to do well in his exams and graduate. Then find decent work, and contribute to society. But for now, study.

  96. #98 by DarkHorse on Tuesday, 4 December 2007 - 6:51 am

    “Kit’s reminder is for ALL bloger” limkampout

    Yeah, you wish! Kit chose to do so as part of his reply to your complaint. What does that tell posters?? You are crude and rude. You don’t expect Kit to be like you, do you?

    It does not take a rocket scientist to figure out to whom that advice was directed. You, limkampout are the only poster here who fits the description, calling other posters names like “moron”, “stupid”, “spineless” to name but a few.

    Freedom of speech to you means the freedom to bash others for not sharing your opinion or ignoring your comments, your purported “ability to hold more than three variable in your head” – to use your own words. LOL. You bashed Jeffrey and Lee Wang Yeng and there are posters here who would do the same to you if you continue with your tirade.

    You asked what’s wrong with labeling others “stupid” “moron” “spineless” and threatening to belittle posters with derogatory comments etc?? Which hole did you crawl from?

    In case you miss out what Goddam Singh said about you on another thread, here let me cut and paste so you could read it at your convenience and reflect:

    ///Obviously our limkampuiiiiiet has chosen to ignore a polite and diplomatic reminder by Kit to him in reply to his enquiry as to why his post has been deleted – as follows:

    [“Can I also urge all posters to respect all other posters and visitors by refraining from using langauge which are crude, vulgar and offensive. – Kit]

    He has just added another one-liner to the string of one-liners to posters:

    “You are a spineless bastard”

    Here are the rest of his “quotable quotes” littered all over the threads:

    “I think the more you write, the more you show your stupidity”

    “We are what we repeatedly do. it is confirmed that you are more than stupid”

    “I suggest you go for grade one english class first before you come here” to

    “Colonel my foot. You are not even qualified to be private.”

    We would like to know what does it take for him to acknowledge the need to observe civility in the exchanges since a polite reminder from the blog owner has failed.///

    So stop abusing the opportunity afforded to posters by YB Kit who has worked hard to provide the platform. We are here to discuss serious issues. We are not here to show how smart we are and who are not. We disagree if we have to but without the name calling.

  97. #99 by ktteokt on Tuesday, 4 December 2007 - 7:48 am

    After these demonstrations, MALAYSIA is now indeed in the international limelight. This time around, Malaysia can really claim that “MALAYSIA BENAR-BENAR BOLEH!!” – shameful, that is.

  98. #100 by Godfather on Tuesday, 4 December 2007 - 10:53 am

    Yes, I agree that those warring parties should stop hijacking the threads in this blog for airing personal insults. The war is out there, and you guys are throwing eggs at each other. Don’t really know what else to say except to sigh.

  99. #101 by Jong on Tuesday, 4 December 2007 - 11:58 am

    Aiyoo grrreat learned kids, hurling eggs at each other – ganging up and batu api aplenty! I’ve been away and plenty to read and wow, am learning new words!

    Christmas is in the air, and new year just around the corner so let’s keep the peace.

  100. #102 by sotong on Tuesday, 4 December 2007 - 12:40 pm

    We are beginning to see real and powerful characters in this blog.

    This is interesting!

  101. #103 by limkamput on Tuesday, 4 December 2007 - 5:11 pm

    “You are a spineless bastard”
    DarkHorse has accused me of saying the above. I did not use the word bastard, never. Out of respect for Kit, I will not retaliate further. Let others who have read this blog in totality form their own opinion. I don’t have all the time go through what others, in particular DarkHorse, Godamn Singh and Undergrad2 have said of me. From now on, let this blog be their private domain. Bye bye.

  102. #104 by DarkHorse on Tuesday, 4 December 2007 - 7:15 pm

    A great lesson to learn!

    Freedom of speech does not give anyone the right to bash the other merely for giving his opinion. Right is not might.

    Never bash our Jeffrey. Never bash the likes of Lee Wang Yen who as a Malaysian scholar studying at the world’s second best University according to THES, is a fine example of a Malaysian Chinese who despite policies like the NEP have done us proud! They are not examples of “hollow sophistication” to be made use of to feed anybody’s ego.

    We hope you go away a better human being, humbled in the thought that in a civil society, it pays to be civil. Something our BN MPs need to learn.

  103. #105 by undergrad2 on Wednesday, 5 December 2007 - 8:09 am

    It is time to leave him alone, Horse.

  104. #106 by rakyatmiskin on Wednesday, 5 December 2007 - 2:11 pm

    Hmmmmm….., I have been an observer of this site and frankly I enjoy readings of DarkHorse, Undergrad2, Godfather, and few others as well….I seriously think everyone should leave “Limkampuuuut” alone :) he is entitled to his opinion too even if it means in every negative way :) let him speak….and you speak too if you guys dont like him, just dont reply to his comments. simple na :) by the WHY Godamn Singh :D
    keep on writing I love reading them, I normally save it on my PC and read them later no time na :(

  105. #107 by undergrad2 on Wednesday, 5 December 2007 - 10:30 pm

    Apparently someone let the dogs out!

  106. #108 by Jong on Wednesday, 5 December 2007 - 11:32 pm

    :):):) Yep the foggers are coming!

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