Why are the MCA, Gerakan, MIC and other non-Muslim Ministers silent on another body-snatching case after the divisive Moorthy case two years ago where S. kaliammal, the widow of Everest mountaineer L/Kpl M. Moorthy, found only grief and injustice when she had no remedy in any court in the dispute as to whether her husband was a Hindu or a Muslim?
At the time, Malaysians were given the assurance that the Prime Minister, Datuk Seri Abdullah Ahmad Badawi and his Barisan Nasional cabinet ministers would ensure that Malaysian inter-racial and inter-religious unity and harmony as well as Malaysia’s international reputation as a model of multi-religious nation would not again be marred by more body-snatching incidents.
However, the body-snatching incidents have not stopped, with the latest case involving the police seizing the body of Gan Eng Gor, who died a week ago aged 74, after his eldest son – himself a Muslim convert – said he had converted to Islam last year. This claim had been challenged by Gan’s wife and his seven other children.
(Speech at the DAP Kepayang dinner in Ipoh Barat on Sunday, 27th January 2008 at 10 pm)
#1 by Samson on Monday, 28 January 2008 - 10:44 pm
Injustice!!! The Gan family must fight to get back their rights. Hopefully DAP can help the family.
In the event nothing can be done I suggest that the Gan family carried out the chinese burial ceremony on the Muslim burial ground now and every year during Cheng Beng.
Truth and Justice for Malaysian
#2 by BoycottLocalPapers on Monday, 28 January 2008 - 11:08 pm
Yes, I agree with Samson there. I do not know how the Gan family handled this situation. If they physically fight with these strangers for the body of their father when these irreligious bigot strangers took away the body of their father or rake back the body after the burial, I will not blame them as I myself do not know what to do in this type of situation. Furthermore, these strangers have no right to take the body of their father away from them. These irreligious bigots are very cruel!
This kind of situation really make us non-Muslims in Malaysia really feel helpless as there is no law to protect us from these irreligious bigots and the police who is supposed to help us will not do anything to stop these irreligious bigots from harming us.
#3 by BoycottLocalPapers on Monday, 28 January 2008 - 11:09 pm
CORRECTION:
rake back = take back
#4 by Rocky on Monday, 28 January 2008 - 11:21 pm
the elder son didn’t take care of his father who he claimed who was a muslim. The father was eating in a non halal house. That is a big sin and the muslim son has dine a terriblething even the converting of his father will not be able to give ‘pahala’ to recover from things he did not do as a muslim son. what kind of son is this guy? even a non muslim son knows to take care of the father and provide for him. what kind of muslim son is this? doesn’t islam say take care of the elders?
really sick son…but heck a ‘good’ muslim…
#5 by waterfrontcoolie on Monday, 28 January 2008 - 11:28 pm
May be this is a LESSON for ALL non-muslims to make a declaration in writing every time a member of their family has decided to embrace ISLAM to say that he or she is no longer connected to the family and do not want to have anything to do with him or her!! Otherwise, the friendly attitude can be linked to conversion by association!!
Soon everyone could die as one, whenever someone decided to proclaim that you have some how ‘converted’ without you knowing.! Is corpse counting is indeed that important for the ‘progress’ of any faith??
#6 by Michael Sun on Tuesday, 29 January 2008 - 12:03 am
I have attended several funerals where the deceased died as a Christian but buried in accordance with Buddhist/Toaist rites. Such incidences do occur when the deceased decided to become a Christian (before he died) with the full knowledge of some members of the family. However other members of the family (normally the elder or more influential male siblings) do not recognised the conversion.
When confronted with such dilemma, Church pastors would advise that the deceased be buried following a non-Christian rites to maintain peace and harmony in the family. Why? Are the Christians weaker in their faith?
No! Christians believe that upon death, they will be given a new body and there is no need to fight over a dead body. Death is a period of joy for Christians as the deceased will be in HIS kingdom.
What is most baffling, is why should the Islamic authorities fight like hell to seize a dead body of a person who has been eating pork and therefore is obviously “haram” to be buried in a “halal” Muslim cemetry? Wouldn’t the dead body then pollute the halal cemetry?
It is time for the BN government to review the dichotomy between Muslim and non-Muslim religions before it becomes a “holy war”. Islam as practised in Malaysia is a one-way street. Masuk boleh; Keluar Tak Boleh. How could a Hindu father, upon becoming a Muslim, converts his underaged child to become a Muslim? After that the poor child upon becoming an adult, he cannot choose the religion of his choice?
If the child choose to marry a Catholic girl later in his life, he cannot do it unless she converts even though the Koran allows marriage amongst people of the Book ie Jews, Christians and Muslims. Malaysia prohibits such marriage but allowed in many Islamic countries.
Is this the justice and compassion as preached by the prophet Mohamad (pbuh)in Islam? I am sure the prophet will object to this body snatching exercise to increase the Muslim statistics! .
Vote Opposition. Vote DAP. “Just Change It”
#7 by DarkHorse on Tuesday, 29 January 2008 - 1:17 am
“In the event nothing can be done I suggest that the Gan family carried out the chinese burial ceremony on the Muslim burial ground now and every year during Cheng Beng.” Samson
Stoking the flames of racial discord is irresponsible to say the least, and what’s more may get the host in deep trouble. There are enemies of the DAP waiting for comments on this blog like this one.
#8 by kaybeegee on Tuesday, 29 January 2008 - 2:19 am
The moment Gan senior converted to Islam, if at all he did, his marriage to his non Muslim wife will be annulled, if she did not follow him and convert. So what did the Islamic religious department do about Gan Senior, after he converted to Islam, if at all he did, by giving him lessons in Islam and how to pray etc etc.
If at all Gan senior converted to Islam, his children should be Muslims too? We now know that the deceased had objected to his son making his name Abdullah, ironically he made his father Abdullah as well. Muslims should know that not all those who convert to marry your children get the blessings of their family, but smiles shown are artificial.
Why was his wife not informed? Is the Islamic Religious department more interested in statistics that another born non Muslim has taken the one way street into Islam? Our Press take pride in highlighting non Muslims converting to islam, and if it is a white person the greater the publicity. The Islamic religious department should not allow people to convert to Islam like changing clothes.
A pronunciation by the Syariah Court does not bind the non Muslims, but because the guns are with the Police, we obey but obey out of fear.
Why are the Royal Malaysia Police Force assisting to enforce religious state law which is not Federal Law? Will the Royal Malaysia Police force help a non Muslim spouse get back a body of a born Muslim who has murtaded?
When Kelantan wanted to enforce Hudud, the Police say that are out of it.Why be present at the funeral? Can the Police be neutral,impartial? I fear not.
All you guys who have converted to Islam, spread the word round that your spouse can be with with your family. Will Lina Joy enjoy such relationship or her husband take his in- laws shopping?
Which religion is tolerant ? I am told that Islam is The Religion of Peace(TROP). Where can I find this Islam?
To the Gan family, they have taken his body, but not his soul. They cant stop you from observing whatever rites you want to do, and do at home.
#9 by BoycottLocalPapers on Tuesday, 29 January 2008 - 2:58 am
QUOTE
kaybeegee Says:
Today at 02: 19.47 (27 minutes ago)
Which religion is tolerant ? I am told that Islam is The Religion of Peace(TROP). Where can I find this Islam?
END QUOTE
………………………………………………………………..
BoycottLocalPapers Says:
There is no such thing because Muslims have been fighting against fellow Muslims since the beginning of Islam. If you refer to articles about Islam at Raja Petra’s blog and your Sejarah textbook or if you have attended Ugama Islam class (as in my case I stayed in the class during the Islamic lesson when I was in national school), I am sure you have heard about civil wars among the first followers of this Religion of Peace.
#10 by k1980 on Tuesday, 29 January 2008 - 8:23 am
Can the following documents of conversion with its numerous errors hold up in court? Click on each document to enlarge
http://hsudarren.wordpress.com/2008/01/27/documents-of-the-alleged-conversion/
#11 by k1980 on Tuesday, 29 January 2008 - 8:54 am
Religion of Peace?
Psst, George Bush is also a man of PEACE. Look at the millions of Afghans and Iraqis he has slaughtered to date so that he can have PEACE. Dead people will not disturb the peace
#12 by dawsheng on Tuesday, 29 January 2008 - 9:20 am
Why is PAS say nothing about this case and why did Anwar been keeping quiet too? Uncle Kit, you should press them for some answers (since PKR had an electoral pact with DAP), at least make a statement on whether they (PAS or PKR) support body-snatching or dead against it. We needs some answers.
#13 by cheng on Tuesday, 29 January 2008 - 10:26 am
Body snatching practise is for religion and people with inferiority complex and low EQ. Remember they guy who asked by an international news channel about Lina Joy? I don’t remember the name of that idiot, not worth remembering. Anyway, he said something like this, “…if we allow that, Malay will be finished…”. He said Malay, not Islam. Don’t ask me, you should know why he said that.
You know, that kind of people is always living under imaginery threat. When they see a temple or church, they feel offended. I don’t feel offended with any temple, mosque, or church. They have no vision, it is all about fight. What are they going to do when the fight is over? They will just feel “shiok” for a while and find something else to fight for again. Read the Romance of the Three Kingdom. People is planning for peace and how to rule the country in advance before the war.
Serial rapist don’t actually go for sex. They love to see the victims fight back and then overpower the victims.
If everyone of us converted to Islam, these people will be dumb strucked. To win, give your opponent a surprise. Read the Book of Five Rings by samurai warrior, Musashi Miyamoto, pretty much like the Sun Tzu Art of War.
Being emotional is definitely of no help…
#14 by kaybeegee on Tuesday, 29 January 2008 - 10:52 am
UMNO should pass a law that in future if any non Muslim converts to islam, here in Malaysia, irrespective of his or her nationality,UMNO the Government will have the proud and happy occassion published by way of a legal anouncement in all newspapers in Malaysia.Not just the conversion of non Muslims to islam when announcing a marriage to a Muslim by the newspapers.
The new Muslim should have no objections to such anouncements.
I read the documents in hsudarrens blog. Incredible that such incomplete documents can be accepted in such a solemn occassion like a change of religion.
Unfortunately Muslim judges, whether Civil or Syariah are duty bound to also convert non Muslims to Islam. They cant allow “one to get away”.
UMNO should use the multi religious resources of Malaysia to handle such issues. Get a Judge who is neither Muslim nor Buddhist to determine such cases in future.
I am not sure whether real Islam wants converts who are just hypocrites….those for marriage…..for position…..for convenience.One thing for sure you must convert out of your own free will to be Muslim. The guy or woman who converts to get married is that being done on own free will?
#15 by RGRaj on Tuesday, 29 January 2008 - 11:33 am
This issue has found it’s way to Faithfreedom.org, and now the whole world will know how Islam is being practiced in Malaysia.
I wonder why no Malays are protesting about this. Their inaction & silence will make the non-Muslims to hate Islam even more. And I won’t blame them.
#16 by 9to5 on Tuesday, 29 January 2008 - 1:51 pm
It would be very interesting to question Shasainie Siau (bad meaning in hokkien) Abdullah in any court of law who had witnessed the alleged thumb print at the address stated when the senior Gan was not even there. Why don’t the press or news media interview this Shasainie Siau whose position, office and department are stated the the declaration certificate to get to the bottom of the truth?
In the Maklumat Memohon, the converting authority don’t even know who the wife and family of Gan Eng Gor are. There is not even a photo of Gan which probably supports the evidence that Gan wasn’t even there. The dates are untidily changed for some reason and superimposed with new dates. To top it all, there is not even an officer from the islamic authority to “sahkan” the Ikrar Memeluk Agama Islam! The whole episode runs smacks of a hastily done con job or forgery.
This low entry level imposed by the islamic authorities will only attract adulteries, asset snatchers, revengers and others not of pure heart as members. It shows the authorities are just hard-up for members and not the genuine love for propagation of the goodness of Islam!
It does not help either when the Syariah courts endorse the muslim son of Gan. Is this the low standard of evidence accepted by the Syariah court. How can such a court with a low standard and credibility be an official court in Malaysia even surpassing the civil courts? It’s a laughing stock of the world!
The fact that a Syariah court judge who is supposedly beyond material things is caught red handed with accepting bribes recently of a small amount speaks volume about the credibility of this court! Again, it doesn’t help either, in the Lingam RCI the judges who are mentioned accepting gifts and moneys are also of a certain religion!
#17 by Samson on Tuesday, 29 January 2008 - 5:23 pm
“Stoking the flames of racial discord is irresponsible to say the least, and what’s more may get the host in deep trouble. There are enemies of the DAP waiting for comments on this blog like this one.”-DarkHorse
This has nothing to do with stoking the racial discord. This is the matter of rituals/ceremonials beliefs, the constitutional rights which should be accorded to the affected family. To a Chinese, which the Muslims bigots can never understand, customary ceremonies and rituals are important, therefore to snatch the body from the family will deprive the family from performing the rituals and rites for the beloved father at the burial or in the event of upcoming festivals.
In the mind of the family, the deceased father did not convert to Muslim and died as a Taoist/Buddhist. In Chinese traditions/beliefs, it is the duty of the living to pray for and feed the dead during Cheng Beng. So unjustly was the body been taken away with NO RESPECT to the mourning family therefore it is fair that at least the family members be given the rights to perform their ceremonial rites during any up coming Chinese festivals at the burial site.
In terms of legal implications as to whether the deceased is a Muslim or not, there is NONE as the case was an outright robbery and snatching by the authorities. Clearly we see great INJUSTICE has been done to the Chinese minority family.
The party that started the racial discords and injustice are always the people in authority.
JUSTICE MUST prevail to ALL.
#18 by undergrad2 on Tuesday, 29 January 2008 - 9:00 pm
“JUSTICE MUST prevail to ALL.”
When the law has been manipulated, justice is no longer justice. But ideologues on the internet will not bring the justice we seek nearer.
#19 by DarkHorse on Tuesday, 29 January 2008 - 9:40 pm
“In the event nothing can be done I suggest that the Gan family carried out the chinese burial ceremony on the Muslim burial ground now and every year during Cheng Beng.†Samson
To do so would be to blasphemy Islam. You don’t want to do that.
#20 by ktteokt on Tuesday, 29 January 2008 - 9:51 pm
Malaysia has twisted and distorted Islam to suit its likes and fancies. This makes Malaysian Islam a “MUTANT” which cannot be accepted in Islamic countries, so how can it then proclaim itself to be an ISLAMIC NATION?
#21 by alaneth on Tuesday, 29 January 2008 - 11:57 pm
There is no case of Body-Snatching in other Muslim countries.
In wahhabi Saudi Arabia, in taliban Afghanistan, in extremist Iran, there is not a single case of non-Muslims snatached and buried as Muslims.
They say the dead cannot talk – so they cannot testify they are not Muslims.
But the Dead can Vote!….
#22 by alaneth on Wednesday, 30 January 2008 - 12:07 am
No use talking & expressing our anger here….
No use if this issue is confined inside DAP blog only – of course we all here will vote DAP.
All should go out & debate/discuss this news to your other friends of different political ideology – use this as a stepping stone, tell others – we have one choice, one solution – Vote DAP!!!
#23 by alaneth on Wednesday, 30 January 2008 - 12:19 am
The US Dept of State is watching us closely on Religious Freedom annually.
Don’t believe? Visit these sites:
http://www.state.gov/g/drl/rls/irf/2007/90143.htm (Malaysia)
http://www.state.gov/g/drl/rls/irf/2007/ (World)
#24 by kaybeegee on Wednesday, 30 January 2008 - 4:57 pm
Alaneth. Correction. Malaysia is not a Muslim country. Are you an UMNO member? Malaysia it is claimed is Muslim majority, and that too possibly with the arrivals of Indons and Filipinos.
But if you say the ARMED services are 90% Muslim you are right.