Me thinks something is stirring in the Pakatan Rakyat and UMNO camps. The winds of change seems to blow ever so slowly. Diversions are being thrown around here and there by Pakatan Rakyat. The issue of selling beers in Selangor seem to take a life of its own unencumbered by thoughts of Pakatan unity. There is the ‘life and death struggle’ of Pakatan Rakyat in Selangor and the internal ‘bickering’ between PAS and DAP. For Barisan they want Selangor back and the word is out that they are confident enough to look at holding elections in Perak…it all points to the classic diversionary tactics of ‘creating a crisis’ – but by whom? Barisan or Pakatan?
What is self-evident now is that there is a growing momentum towards creating a Malaysia the people are unfamiliar with. The dismantling of the great racial divide, the real possibility of Pakatan Rakyat emerging as the next Government after the General Elections (at worse an effective opposition) and the potential demise of UMNO and the Barisan Coalition it leads as the Party in power.
Concurrently as part and parcel of this progression there is an increasing demand by the people for transparency and openness in Government – akin to Putri Gunung Ledang agreeing to marry the Sultan if given:
A bridge made of pure gold from Malacca to Mount Ledang;
Another bridge made of pure silver from Mount Ledang to Malacca;
Seven trays (dulang) of the hearts of mosquitoes;
Seven trays (dulang) of the hearts of the germs;
Seven jars (tempayan) of the juice of young betel nuts
Seven jars (tempayan) of the tears of the virgins
One bowl of blood from his fondest and only son.
All this makes for a vigorous and excitable population impatient for changes that they have long waited to come. And now that the time for change is almost here – the nearness of it happening have made any more waiting unbearable. They want the changes to happen now. They want the ISA to be abolished now. They want what is wrong with this country to be corrected now. And accountability at all levels of Government now.
In this atmosphere of potential crisis – what separates order and chaos is a very fine line.
It is in the interest of Pakatan Rakyat to have the people on edge but disciplined and focused on the task ahead – the orderly transition from Opposition to Government.
What UMNO/Barisan will do in a crisis situation would decide the future of democracy in our country.
In a crisis situation the challenges to be faced by those in power, in the aftermath of any crisis, would depend on what it wants to achieve – for the country, for the people and most critical for themselves–because it present opportunities to secure leadership status and legitimacies, preferred political alliances and political exploitation to maintain their status quo. It would also present opportunities to push through desired policy ‘reforms’ for the nation’s advantage of for it’s own.
How would UMNO negotiate the aftermath of a political crisis of its own making?
The crisis could be a catalyst to creating or blocking reforms within the country. It could be used to galvanized or ‘guide’ the population towards desired goals.
There will also be a need to identify accountability. Who will accept or deny responsibility for the crisis. What failures and weakness will be hidden and what will be exposed.
Finally what will be the end game of the crisis. Will dissent be stifled if not totally eliminate? Will those in power put into place checks and balance to ensure that another crisis will not occur or will it use the opportunity to consolidate and reinforce power and their leadership position as soon as possible?
When we consider all these possibilities it is essential that nothing should happen that would turn brinkmanship to disaster and yet if we are scared to go too the brink, we will lose. There is a need for us to understand that in a crisis situation there is a clear and present danger that the resulting chaos will be taken advantage of by Barisan to secure their hold on power for the foreseeable future. We only need to see the use of the ISA to curtail dissent during Ops Lallang resulting in the arrest of so many of our own people. And since then the use of power at its disposal to ensure opponents of Barisan are incarcerated as been the norm. We cannot take that chance.
And so I urged the leaders within PakatanRakyat to educate and instill in its members the need to remain calm under extreme provocation, the need to refrain form overt display of anger or force when confronted by the overwhelming force of PDRM. The need for restrain in order to not allow the powers that be to create a crisis situation and to blame that resulting situation on us. For then they could proceed to assume complete control of our country and do what they want and as they please for decades to come.
We would have need for leaders within our ranks that are able to take us through these trouble time and see it through to the end so that the end result will ensure the beginning of a new dawn. Do not let them push us over the edge.
#1 by Jaswant on Thursday, 13 August 2009 - 10:07 am
For many Malays it is still “Why bite the hand that feeds you” even though the feeding process may be flawed.
#2 by SpeakUp on Thursday, 13 August 2009 - 10:28 am
“We would have need for leaders within our ranks that are able to take us through these trouble time and see it through to the end so that the end result will ensure the beginning of a new dawn.”
This is well said and is what we need in a leader. Someone who is level headed, someone how is of fair temperament, able to think for the Rakyat and always has the Rakyat’s best interest at heart.
BUT in PR we hardly have any leaders who are capable of this. Its getting to be dog eat dog in there. Why? How come?
DSAI as I have always said, has failed to take the lead as De Facto Leader of the Opposition. LKS has done nothing openly to hold PR intact. Hadi has also failed to curb the nonsense that has appeared of late.
Damaging issues that were brought up openly have never been dealt with openly. Once upon a time before bloggers etc, the public cried out “Justice needs to be seen if its to be done”.
We need to see that PR deals with recalcitrant members such as Kulim MP, Wee Choo Keong, Azmin, Johari etc.
We can only pray today’s PR meeting actually will come up with a solution for all such nonsense and not another spin project by Tok Dalang DSAI himself.
#3 by pulau_sibu on Thursday, 13 August 2009 - 10:31 am
No, not about this one. Let’s talk about Ti-ong (Tiong and Ong) to see who is a gangster and who provided dead threats. It is now very interesting.
#4 by SpeakUp on Thursday, 13 August 2009 - 10:42 am
PKFZ … how nice … Donations, usage of private jets. Actually, many have used private jets, even certain royalty and other politicians. It seems like the private jet is like a private bus. Ask around and you will find out. :)
#5 by k1980 on Thursday, 13 August 2009 - 11:04 am
If otk is truly innocent of Tiong’s RM10million gift,why hasn’t he made a police report by now? Is he scared of falling from the 14th floor of the macc building?
After watching unmo leaders waving their keris, a 7 year-old Year One schoolboy pulled down his classmate’s pants and slashed his testes with a penknife. When he enters Form 5, this 17 year-old hero is going to pull down his principal’s trousers and slash off the whole bunch!
#6 by Jaswant on Thursday, 13 August 2009 - 11:11 am
A whole bunch?? [deleted]
#7 by SpeakUp on Thursday, 13 August 2009 - 11:58 am
DR Tiong is not dumb, he knows what he is doing. OTK is really in a fix now. Hahahahaahaaa …
#8 by Loh on Thursday, 13 August 2009 - 12:02 pm
The argument that beers should not be sold in areas where Muslims form the majority in the area is untenable. It is so because the term area can take on any size. Taking the country as a whole, beer would be banned from Malaysia based on that argument.
It is not fighting for Islam to ban non-halal food or drinks, since Muslims know what they ought or ought not to consume. If the ban is needed to ensure that Muslims observe the teachings of their religion, then it would be an insult to them for lacking of discipline. It would also cast aspersion to the teaching of the religion since religion does not require human to work for its greatness. It is great by virtue of its teaching.
Malaysians travel around the world, and they are exposed to the sale of non-halal items. If they can resist any bad influence on the sale of non-halal items openly abroad, they can very well do it at home. Thus it is not doing any good to Islam to ban the sale of beer, in whatever areas. The person who proposed such ban was doing it for political purposes. When beer can be banned, so can pork, and there will be no end to the item.
In the residential colleges in University Malaya in the pre-1969 days, halal and non-halal meals were served, and students of different faith shared the same dining table to consume different foods. Have we gone so far backward when beer cannot be sold in the areas where there are more Muslims than others? If Muslims suffer because of the sale of beer when they are in the majority, they suffer the same when in minority. What does Hassan Ali plan to help those who had to suffer, for whatnots we do not know, when they are living in areas when beer continued to be sold?
#9 by frankyapp on Thursday, 13 August 2009 - 12:16 pm
why do you guys focus on a few trees and missing the big forest ? The beer,the pork and a few naughty ybs are all family petty issues.please don’t blow it out of proportion as it would fall into umno/bn trap.I think some of you guys are umno/bn spies.you guys purposely painted all these petty issues of the PR family into explosive ones.A kind of propaganda tactic to arouse the public feeling against PR and also giving a perception that PR is not capable to run state government.Thanks GOD the public or the rakyat/voters are pretty smart nowadays and hence would not be fooled by umno/bn whom we all know are bend to destroy PR so that they could remain in power.umno/bn can fool some people some times but will not be able to fool all the people all the time.Guys be smart,anticipate what’s going on,seek the truth by digesting the lies as spread by umno/bn propagandists.
#10 by ekompute on Thursday, 13 August 2009 - 12:59 pm
“And so I urged the leaders within PakatanRakyat to educate and instill in its members the need to remain calm under extreme provocation, the need to refrain form overt display of anger or force when confronted by the overwhelming force of PDRM.”
I am not well-versed in politics. But I always wonder why politics have not taken a lesson from business marketing. What I am talking about is MLM which many companies have succeeded in reaching a wide membership. Supposing PR starts a multi-level system where each member is supposed to recruit 6 members out of which two must be Malay, two Chinese, one Indian, and one any. These recruiters are supposed to disseminate information and guide their “downlines”. Then the “downlines” do the same and recruit another 6 members each. PR then give ranks to members who fulfil certain criteria… just like Emerald, Diamond, or whatever. When the membership reach a certain size, the one on top is allowed to start a branch and becomes the head of the branch. This way, solicitation for membership is very fast and dissemination of information too.
#11 by ekompute on Thursday, 13 August 2009 - 1:04 pm
Need it be said? But truth is truth. Counter lies with truth is all I can say. Truth be said, I don’t like the way PAS is acting… I think they have been infiltrated by UMNO.
#12 by SpeakUp on Thursday, 13 August 2009 - 1:07 pm
Of course, there are so many BN infiltrators out there. I mean they made Wee Choo Keong and Azmin call for reshuffle, Wee made very serious allegations too. Then BN infiltrators also made PAS raise the issue of beers. The the same BN infiltrators also got Johari in Penang to boycott LGE.
Yeah … darn terror man these BN people!
#13 by ekompute on Thursday, 13 August 2009 - 1:25 pm
Well, I don’t blame UMNO for doing that. After all, this is politics and they are desperate. Never in history have they been underdogs until recently. But PR is so weak, I must say. Otherwise, it would not have fall to such no-brainer tactics that even non-politicians like me can think of.
#14 by Loh on Thursday, 13 August 2009 - 1:43 pm
The beer issue is not petty in the sense that it involves principle. It is a question of whether PAS accepts religious freedom as provided under Article 11 of the constitution. Article 11 (1) reads: Every person has the right to profess and practise his religion and…..
Muslims are prohibited from taking liqueur and beer, but non-Muslims are not. To ban the sale of beer is to infringe on the right of non-Muslims, if a ban is universal; or inconvenient them when the ban is only local.
There are PAS members who support Hassan Ali, but there are others they do not. Pakatan Rakyat will have to help PAS rid of those extremists as leaders in their party. When a compromise has to be made to accommodate UMNO moles, there will be no end to other extreme views and actions. There is no point having an alternate government when it is worse than BN. To prevent that, the extremists in PAS should not be allowed to develop their political strength.
Malaysians want BN out of power, but we do not want a worse replacement.
#15 by frankyapp on Thursday, 13 August 2009 - 2:06 pm
Hi ekompute and speakup,don’t say PR is so weak and yeah…darn terror man these bn people.Instead tell PR that when the tough gets tougher,the tough gets going.Like I said guys,politic is politic,it’s an art to win and umno/bn are just doing it,though not according to the book. Umno/bn have no option to lose,hence they have pretty lots of spies being infiltracted like you guys said and setting all sorts of deadly traps to finish off its enemies ie PR. PR can do this as well but find it difficult due to lack of fund/cash/money.Umno/bn are cash rich,hence many have and many more would work for them as infiltractors ,maybe including some of you guys.Hence again don’t simply said darm terror man these bn people cos you may becoming one of them.
#16 by SpeakUp on Thursday, 13 August 2009 - 2:12 pm
“Malaysians want BN out of power, but we do not want a worse replacement.” – Well said … how true. Now if only those diehard PR supporters can see that. No one is saying PR is useless but no one wants something dodgy too.
ekompute … PR did not work on SOLIDARITY, it was only united to fight BN. So remove BN from the equation, what do we have? Chaos! This is what we are seeing since PR has won so many seats, some ADUNs and MPs are getting big headed.
So like what has been recently said, its time to teach ALL politicians a lesson.
#17 by ekompute on Thursday, 13 August 2009 - 2:24 pm
Looking at things, BN and PR are equally bad choice. But we do need a two-party system if democracy is to work in Malaysia. So let’s have PR for a change, whether be they good or not. Things are pretty bad now, so having a two-party system is the only assurance for a better government.
#18 by Onlooker Politics on Thursday, 13 August 2009 - 2:31 pm
“There is no point having an alternate government when it is worse than BN. To prevent that, the extremists in PAS should not be allowed to develop their political strength.” (Loh)
Loh is right in saying that the extremists should not be allowed to develop their political strength.
Perhaps a party membership purge programme like “Cheng Feng Campaign” ( also called “Zheng Feng Campaign” or “Yan An Rectification Movement”) of Communist Party of China during 1930s will be required. This kind of membership purge is not only required by PAS. It is also needed by DAP and Pakatan Rakyat.
Even though dissident opinions or dissenting opinions should be tolerated within the Party, this reasoning shall not provide rationale to justify phillisbustering of the party policy or intra party government policy which may risk running out of intra party disciplinary control.
For the outsiders, party unity and party discipline of a political organisation such as Pakatan Rakyat is much more important than the unlimited freedom of voicing out dissident opinions or dissenting opinions to the news media.
#19 by Jeffrey on Thursday, 13 August 2009 - 2:35 pm
//The beer issue is not petty in the sense that it involves principle//- #14 by Loh on August 13th, 2009 13:43.
I agree with with what Loh said. Religious freedom (article 11) is certainly part of argument. Ban of beer sale in Muslim majority area will affect Non Muslims in that area in sense that they are inconvenienced to have to go perhaps out of that area to purchase beers. More important this has not happened in last 50 years. A pre-existing right of easy access to beer on part of non Muslims is taken away by such a move. Besides how does one draw the line? The whole of the country is Muslim Majority! Can it not be extended to whole country?
There is however another principle at stake which concerns all Malaysians, whether muslims or non Muslims – and that is the extent to which administration/government (whether federal or state) should act paternalistically (like a parent) to treat subjects (as children) and use its powers to enforce morality (including staying from beers).
I accept that education, parental guidance and even Religion may be used to discourage vices which many will regard alcohol as coming under such category. This is however very different from using government (whether state/federal) to legislate in manner enforcing it.
Until recently Malaysia being pluralistic had maintained a kind of distinction what is private domain and public domain, and issues like courting couples expressing affection in the park or buying beer has been left to individual’s freedom and judgment after being taught what is right and wrong by parents, teachers and community leaders. The state does not interfere to use its power of legislation to prohibit, ban, harrass and arrest.
What we witness now is a creeping move (with PAS leading the way) towards erosion of personal freedom to make choices.
Do we want this kind of government? It is attaining its theocratic Islamic state if such marginal moves, step by step advanced by it are not resisted, whether by the BN or Pakatan Rakyat leaders. It is attaining its objective slowly and surely because many Malaysians being fed up with existing ruling coalition and aspiring to have it replaced are willing to close one eyes based on philosophy of “Ends justify the Means” to tolerate such encroachments on personal liberties of all Malaysians.
I read from The MalaysianInsider Aug 12 that “The three allies in the Pakatan Rakyat electoral pact are almost certain to take a big step towards a more formal coalition when its leaders hold a key meeting tomorrow that will affirm their stand to work for all Malaysians”….
Dear YB Kit, the key word is “all Malaysians”.
If PAS were not prepared to embrace inclusivist policies of letting Malaysians decide on their own morality and bent on pushing for legislative/govt policies segregating different treatment for Muslims and Non Muslims, where will this lead us and how is DAP going continue collaborating with it? It is a different world from what we have always known since Independence.
I suggest the allies become out with a clear manifesto/constitution of what has to be the bedrock of understanding acceptable to all. If you cannot reach a common ground, what’s the point?
#20 by ekompute on Thursday, 13 August 2009 - 2:40 pm
I think we should not try to impose our opinions on one another. After all, what is democracy if even this website cannot practise it. Let everyone has a say and discuss an issue, based on facts, fundamental reasoning and deductions. Sincerity is important. Even if the facts that one based their reasoning on are wrong, we should not be quick to accuse the other person of twisting facts or having an ulterior motive. Just point out where he goes wrong and all his reasoning will naturally fall flat on its nose. Just because someone don’t believe as you do, you start branding them as this and that. I think this is not the spirit of any matured discussion. We don’t need unanimous consensus in any issue. If we have unanimous consensus all the time, it means either that nobody is thinking or that this website is very heavily censored.
#21 by frankyapp on Thursday, 13 August 2009 - 2:41 pm
Okay guys let’s talk about beer and liqueur and Hassan ali of PAS .Who is this hassan ali,what’s on his mind ? I suggest if he wants PR to win in the 13 GE,he should shut-up and leave the party.He can join some religious fanatic group and becomes its hero.What has beer got to do with politic.People drinks beer to quench thirst.Ok muslim does not drink beer ,very simple please keep your distance away from it and let others have their feast.Why talk about banning it when you don’t need it.Please be considerate of others.Similarly,I don’t go for prostitutes but I’m not calling it to be banned.Why is it so hard for Hassan Ali to understand ? This guy is he a politician for the muslim people only ? If he is ,then it’s best he leaves PR like a man and not get kick out as an infiltractor of umno/bn.
#22 by ekompute on Thursday, 13 August 2009 - 2:49 pm
What would UMNO say if India decide to ban beef in India and stop those morning calls? They will jump, rite. They have the cheek to condemn apartheid while practising apartheid under a different name in their own backyard. UMNO should take a good look at themselves in the mirror. As long as they don’t engage in corruption, abuse of power, telling lies, unfair practices like extending the election referee’s service even to the extent of having to amend the Constitution…. that would suffice.
#23 by frankyapp on Thursday, 13 August 2009 - 2:53 pm
Hi ekompute,I’m only trying to tell you and others to look at the positive side,though not ignoring the negative side at the same time as you guys have been focusing too much on the darkness. hey,please ,no hard feeling ok.I really appreciate your comment.
#24 by lkt-56 on Thursday, 13 August 2009 - 2:57 pm
A Crisis to manage?
Why not indeed!? Bothe sides, politicians are sensing that winds for change are blowing strong and they are unconsciously drawn into this relentless wind that is taking them and all of us into this new era:
Do not fret. Do not judge that squabblings within PR is bad. Most important of all…
DO NOT FEAR for fear will lead us to the wrong path. Stay focussed.
Good to see PR getting together to discuss how to manage their groupings of diverse ideologies. It is a signal that PR is matured enough to stay level headed and REALLY MEAN BUSINESS. The business of forming the next government!
To those who are weak of faith and cynical I have this advice:
Still your fearful and judging minds. That way you will begin to see where we are head to.
#25 by Jeffrey on Thursday, 13 August 2009 - 2:58 pm
Yes many seek to replace govt. to end endemic corruption. Fight corruption we must but are Malaysians (whether Muslims and Non Muslims) indolent about our personal freedoms in relation to choices? We acknowledge authorities can legislate laws on our freedoms if in exercise of them we “harm” others so that in exercise of our individual freedoms we violate the exercise of the same by others.
Here however when we are told that official power will be used to tell us how to stay away from beer or how to dress etc – isn’t this an infringement of our personal freedoms?
Can’t we not – after all the teaching by our parents, teachers, religious and govt leaders and peers – be allowed to exercise our freedom of choice whether to follow the virtuous path or the path mixed by virtue and vice and if “vice” were detrimental due to our wrong choice, isn’t it our fate to face the music due to wrong choices? Why must we have a paternalistic government holding a cane to beat us everytime we make a wrong moral choice that harms only ourselves but not others???
How do we measure or even develop character if everytime we take the path free from vices it is not because of our fre and unfettered choice to choose virtue over vice but only because vices have been obliterated by official government action or if we are beaten by the stick everytime we make wrong choice?
How do we learn personal responsibility and assume consequences of choices if we are not allowed by law and official action from being in the position to exercise choice of whether to stay away from vices or to indulge on some of them???
Are we to be treated as adults or kids?
#26 by Joshua on Thursday, 13 August 2009 - 3:13 pm
What crisis when the system is rotten to the core?
What do you do when someone really have terminal ill? Likely ded and buried.
Now the system of Govt and Opposition are both rotten and infected by the system and the only way is the third force to stop all the squabbles and scams only getting bigger without solution.
So it is for the Interim Government for Good Governance. (IGGG). We need a new beginning.
pw: gfurgiu Santa
#27 by lkt-56 on Thursday, 13 August 2009 - 3:34 pm
A 3rd force: IGGG
That is good too for it is still moving in the direction of the wind of change. ;)
#28 by SpeakUp on Thursday, 13 August 2009 - 5:27 pm
Jeff … the mainstream Muslim needs to be shielded from TEMPTATION … you see there is no concept about working on the person’s FAITH. That is what is being taught to them. Better to have ZERO temptation. Amazing how they work that way.
Frankyapp … I am not saying PR is weak and PERIOD. I am asking them to WAKE UP. Why can’t they? My take is they are scared to wake up due to the fragile pact amongst all 3 parties and within with their own members (not happy quit la! Become independent or join BN because did not get a nice car).
Its time they all wake up and realise theirs is a life of SERVICE to the voters. Wakil Rakyat … that is the word.
#29 by Loh on Thursday, 13 August 2009 - 6:13 pm
///And so I urged the leaders within PakatanRakyat to educate and instill in its members the need to remain calm under extreme provocation, the need to refrain form overt display of anger or force when confronted by the overwhelming force of PDRM. The need for restrain in order to not allow the powers that be to create a crisis situation and to blame that resulting situation on us. For then they could proceed to assume complete control of our country and do what they want and as they please for decades to come.///- Hussein Hamid
Agreed. I would think that there is no need for street demonstration. When Pakatan comes to power, just remove ISA. If pakatan stays in the opposition, why should BN please Pakatan by removing ISA. Ya, some might think that it is important to show that BN is rotten. With their records, there is hardly any need. Pakatan does not have to prove that they are good opposition; they need to show that they will form a better government.
#30 by ekompute on Thursday, 13 August 2009 - 6:33 pm
Hi Frankyapp, thanks for your comment. Some people look at the dark side and some people look at the bright side and then we have a good feel of the whole picture. If everyone looks at the bright side only or everyone looks at the dark side only, we will have a lopsided picture. And we do not have to look at both sides all the time in every message as we are not writing a complete thesis. If you have read some of my previous posts, I have almost always been critical of BN. UMNO and MCA make me vomit blood. But once a while, when they do something good, I do cheer them. But it seems that those posts are almost always censored… which made me come out recently with a comment that says that the censorship here is worst than at chedet.co.cc where I sometimes partipicate. I criticized Mahathir there and expected it to be censored but no, he published it even though, unlike here, he moderates every comment! LOL. That makes me admire him at times, although on the overall, I still cannot forgive him for what he did to my dear Datuk Syed Ahmad Idid, the High Court Judge who tried to expose corruption in the Judiciary.
#31 by Jaswant on Thursday, 13 August 2009 - 6:36 pm
“Religious freedom (article 11) is certainly part of the argument.” Jeffrey
A tiny part, I should say. It is about religious intolerance and religious ‘freedom’ of the Malays and the legitimate rights of the non-Malays.
How does one reconcile conflicting provisions in our constitution of 1957?
Our constitution is an attempt at balancing the conflicting interests of various racial groupings when it should be a statement of principles and ideals for Malaysians as a people and not members of different races.
You cannot fault PAS for wanting to preserve the religious ‘freedom’ of the Malays. The tone set by the country’s founding fathers is one of self-preservation, safeguarding and protecting the way of life of the Malays who as a people living predominantly in rural areas, were largely removed and insulated from the modernizing influences of the west. It was a response to a cultural phenomenon unleashed by the white men concerned only with the economic exploitation of their colony. In doing so the founding fathers accepted the obvious i.e. the view that country’s once cultural and religious homogeneity has been destroyed forever by foreign elements and foreign influences, replaced forever by cultural diversity. A country once wholly Malay is now part Malay.
PAS is the face of this cultural movement aimed at stopping the cultural and religious erosion of Malay values. But stopping the erosion of the Malay way of life is a lot more complex with the coming of the age of the internet as what they seek to preserve is itself changing.
To sum up, PAS is not only a political party but a cultural response to the unresolved issue of cultural identity of a country once homogenous but no longer is, and no longer will be. PAS is a reactionary party or force that has been consistent, unwavering and open and singular in its motive in its pursuit of religious ‘freedom’ for the Malays and in its intention to purge the Malay community of elements which corrupt their way of life.
Cultural diversity is here to stay and PAS has set itself up for failure.
#32 by ekompute on Thursday, 13 August 2009 - 7:51 pm
What is the Malay way of life? Living in kampungs? Wearing songkok and sarung? Bathing in the river? What is it, I really don’t know. All I know today is that I sometimes go and buy pau, chee cheong fun, yong taufu, and roti canai (previously called roti prata when the Indians were selling them) from the Malays.
#33 by ekompute on Thursday, 13 August 2009 - 7:54 pm
What is the Malay way of life? Living in kampungs? Wearing songkok and sarung? Bathing in the river? What is it, I really don’t know. All I know today is that I sometimes go and buy pau, chee cheong fun, yong taufu, and roti canai (previously called roti prata when the Indians were selling them) from the Malays. Unless if you equate Malay way of life with Muslim way of life… but Muslim way of life is not unique to the Malays.
#34 by Loh on Thursday, 13 August 2009 - 8:09 pm
One’s freedom cannot be acquired by stopping others having their; religion, culture and what have you.
#35 by ekompute on Thursday, 13 August 2009 - 8:15 pm
I agree with Loh. Instead of street demonstrations, turn all the major cities into ghost towns by staying at home after work and on weekends. Letting the streets be empty would be a more effective form of non-violent protest.
And why should Pakatan abolish ISA immediately if it comes to power if BN doesn’t do it. Just use the ISA like the way BN uses it and let them have a taste of their own medicine for one term…. yes, one term of 5 years. That would be long enough to teach BN a good lesson in what is meant by a level playing field.
#36 by katdog on Thursday, 13 August 2009 - 8:25 pm
“Just use the ISA like the way BN uses it and let them have a taste of their own medicine for one term…. yes, one term of 5 years” – ekompute
We rail upon PR calling upon them to provide us a better alternative government. Yet we would ask them also to perpetrate the same pettiness and abuse that BN practices?
Oh yeah we reason that in this case ISA is being used against people who deserve it.
How ironic.
#37 by katdog on Thursday, 13 August 2009 - 8:41 pm
Some people have commented that PR is no better than BN. I scratch my head in bemusement there. PR in its short 1.5 years have already brought about more positive changes in the new states compared to BN for the past 15 years.
In Perak, the new villagers were finally given their land titles before BN crashed the party. The ungodly PGCC project in Penang was deservedly scrapped. In Selangor the looting has been put to a stop.
Sure these things are not great achievements but consider whether BN could have achieved even one of those? BN would not have been able to do a single one of those.
So yes, we demand a lot from PR and i agree that PR needs to improve on their performance still. But to say that PR’s performance is equal to BN is probably a grave insult. Because even monkeys sitting around doing absolutely nothing would be better than BN as they wouldn’t be out looting the nations wealth and making complete stupid asses of themselves in the media.
#38 by ekompute on Thursday, 13 August 2009 - 9:01 pm
Some people are kinder than others. Some people even give their left cheek when people slap their right but for me, a tooth for a tooth is fair game. Depends whether you follow the New Testament or the Old, LOL.
#39 by ekompute on Thursday, 13 August 2009 - 9:05 pm
Some people? Who? LOL. Anyway, I am one of them. Can’t you see the cracks in PR? Why do I say PR is equally bad? You have one partner in PAS who is dead-bent to form an Islamic state. Every so often, you see it surfacing. And you have PAS negotiating with UMNO for a merger while still married to PR. So what do you call that when your wife is going out with another man?
#40 by vsp on Thursday, 13 August 2009 - 9:26 pm
For many Malays it is still “Why bite the hand that feeds you” even though the feeding process may be flawed–Jaswant
––––––––
And also for many Chinese who only think of making money!
#41 by katdog on Thursday, 13 August 2009 - 9:59 pm
AGreed. Too many Chinese businessmen along with their cohorts out there all supporting BN. Why do you think polls show that 30% of chinese still support UMNO-Najib?
Rumour has it that it was Vincent Tan that forked out the cash to pay off the 3 kataks in Perak.
#42 by Loh on Thursday, 13 August 2009 - 10:18 pm
Giving RM 10 million to MCA without receipt, like giving away a few dollar notes. Money must have been easy to come by for Tiong. Even then one does not just throw money away. MCA cannot do a Sarawak BN party any favour, certainly not a government position. If Tiong can just give away RM 10 million to MCA, he must have given many times that amount to UMNO. If he was in the habit of giving RM in million without receipt, then MIC and all those little BN component parties could also be benefiting from his handouts. Tiong was known to have organized a group tour to Taiwan in August 2008. Did he also hand out RM millions to members of his tour group?
If Tiong did not bother to keep a receipt, he might not even be bothered to draw cash from the bank; so he must have been keeping cash in suitcases. Giving RM 10 million in three occasions works out to be RM 3.33 million each time. The largest currency note here is RM 100, so he has handed over 33,000 sheets of RM 100 notes each time. They can be packed into 5,500 sheets of A4 size, or two feet in thickness. The bulky transfer would involve more than two persons.
If MACC is responsible to wipe out commercial crime, then it is its duty to ensure that shareholders to Tiong’s listed companies are not taken for a ride. If money politics is a crime, would private jet politics not a crime too?
#43 by Jaswant on Thursday, 13 August 2009 - 10:48 pm
“What is the Malay way of life” ekompute
An easy way to answer this question is to ask:
What is the non-Malay way of life? What is it, ekompute?
#44 by SpeakUp on Friday, 14 August 2009 - 12:30 am
I think street protests are being foolish. Its only allowing BN to play more games, arrest more people and come up with more reasons to clamp down harder.
DSAI wants street protests to snub BN. DSAI wants more arrests to cause more uproar, esp if he is arrested. He does not really care. Have we ever seen DSAI facing the water canons and tear gas? Of course now.
So why bother to do it for him? Remember, only 20K came out, its getting boring now. And yes, it does affect others who are only trying to earn a living.
Remember the 1-Black-Coffee protest, how dare they be so arrogant go to Old Town and say its ok when the owner is not keen to have them there? Is this not the same arrogance BN has? Do what we wan because we want it. Is this what we want to be?
#45 by katdog on Friday, 14 August 2009 - 12:32 am
Well there is no such thing as a non-Malay way of life.
Therefore, i guess the answer then would be, there is no actual thing as a true ‘Malay way of life’?
#46 by ekompute on Friday, 14 August 2009 - 12:52 am
Wow, lateral thinking! Malaysia’s very own Edward de Bono! What is the non-Malay way of life?
Are you saying that non-Malays are a monolithic group? What is a Malay? Honestly, I am confused. Is it a race or a constitutionally-defined group? Is an Indonesian a Malay? Well, it all depends on the context… but one thing is for sure. The context that benefits UMNO is the right context.
#47 by Jaswant on Friday, 14 August 2009 - 1:41 am
“Simple. The Malay way of life is like my life. Sitting around, lepak all day at shopping malls, think of how to pay for the next ‘fix’, maybe snatch a few women’s gold chains and hand bags to pawn, jual ubat at Jalan Masjid India, con people into buying fakes in Jalan Chow Kit, sell smuggled Indon kreteks or make some money as a cross dresser at night.” limkamput
Do you agree with Lim Kam Poot’s definition of the Malay way of life, ekompute??
#48 by ekompute on Friday, 14 August 2009 - 2:33 am
Well, limkamput’s definition is obviously a tongue-in-cheek definition, Jaswant.
To me, I see Malays living in kampungs and I see Malays living in mansions. So which is the true Malay way of life? Are we saying that Malays should live in kampungs?
I see Malays eat with their hands. I also see Malays eating with fork and spoon. So which is the true Malay way of life? Are we saying that Malays should not eat with fork and spoon?
Malays were originally mostly Hindus and animists before Parameswara married the Pasai princess. Are we saying that they should go back to history?
What is the Malay way of life? It keeps changing, I really don’t know. The Constitution of Malaysia offers no clue as to what the Malay way of life is. I think as long as you don’t eat pork, you are Malay, LOL, cos I do see some Malays do not puasa, but practically all of them don’t eat pork.
#49 by Joshua on Friday, 14 August 2009 - 3:49 am
What is this really?
Dtk Lim Guan Eng CM Penang mau Convert muslim?
http://www.sabahforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=4528
Guan Eng jawab, “Tunggu ayah saya meninggal dunia dulu….”
true or not???
pw: sinkiang dence
#50 by johnnypok on Friday, 14 August 2009 - 4:33 am
We drink Coca-cola, eat KFC, wear American jeans, listen to Michael Jackson’s song, and one day our official religion wiIl be changed to Christianity, and the PM is an Iban.
#51 by Jaswant on Friday, 14 August 2009 - 5:00 am
“I think as long as you don’t eat pork, you are Malay, LOL, cos I do see some Malays do not puasa, but practically all of them don’t eat pork.” ekompute
What about Malay guys who kiss their Chinese girlfriends who just had a bowl of ba kut teh? Isn’t it not the same thing?
#52 by ekompute on Friday, 14 August 2009 - 10:29 am
Hi Jaswant, you mean there is a difference between “kiss their Chinese girlfriends” and “kiss their Chinese girlfriends who just had a bowl of ba kut teh?”
I thought there is no difference. Can Muslims kiss their girlfriends, even Muslim girlfriends? Sounds so unMuslim. Leave those kissing to me. I am not Muslim, LOL.
#53 by ekompute on Friday, 14 August 2009 - 10:40 am
On second thoughts, I think Katdog is right. We don’t need the ISA, should PR ever come to power. Abolish ISA straight away. We still have another weapon, a page from Lee Kuan Yew that we may yet learn to use effectively.
Go after those UMNO goons and their BN doggies for corruption. Sue them until they lose their pants and show their naked pecker, that is if they have one. Rafidah Aziz, errrr…. never mind.
Corruption is a crime that is not subject to the Limitations Act. No time bar. PR can even go and investigate the RM76 million missing from Perwaja Steel which Eric Chia managed to escape by invoking Mahathir’s name as in: “I won’t go down alone. I will pull Mahathir along” or something to that effect.
#54 by SpeakUp on Friday, 14 August 2009 - 3:02 pm
Jaswant … maybe kissing is ok because the primary is kissing and not eating the pork. If you want to get around eating pork by kissing the girl friend so that he can savour the wonderful flavour of pork BKT then I guess it should be wrong la. Wanna split more hairs? :)
#55 by Jaswant on Friday, 14 August 2009 - 11:24 pm
“Hi Jaswant, you mean there is a difference between “kiss their Chinese girlfriends” and “kiss their Chinese girlfriends who just had a bowl of ba kut teh?”
A peck on the lips is very different from a French kiss. With the latter you risk swallowing her dentures and left-over pork ribs – even choke yourself to death.