Letters
by Jonathan Tan
It has now been 51 years since independence, and although it was predominantly a Malay Archipelago, immigrants who had to work the land during the British colonial era; by default became citizens after Malaya attained independence in 1957.
Much was promised. Equal rights to jobs, educational and business opportunities. But all this came to naught in 1969 when Tunku Abdul Rahman, Malaysia’ founding father, was unceremoniously sent into early retirement and hawks like Razak and Harun took over and used Malay special rights as their vehicle to build a corrupted society that saw the division between the have and have nots widen.
The process took a turn for the worse during the Mahathir era when he hand picked cronies to award contracts and kept privatized entities such as the Governments’ GLC’s in the government’s stables, obviating the very reason to privatize these entities.
Till this day, these organizations show neither discernible accountability nor transparency. The country bleeds like a wounded kancil.
The situation has become even more tenuous with the serious deterioration of educational standards, where instead of English, Malay was used as the medium of instruction in a multiracial ex-British colony of 300 years, further condemning the country’s young to an educational exposure far less then the previous generation had received all in the name of Malay nationalism and supremacy.
UMNO and Mahathir labeled Malaysia even Islamic with non-Malays forced to take Islamic studies at Universities. The 1957 dream was dead. For Malaysians were not equal neither in the eyes of the government nor the law. You can be a Muslim but you can never unMuslim yourself, so body snatching becomes a norm at funerals by overzealous religious authorities.
In 1957, the MIC and MCA were the designated community guardians to ensure minority rights were protected. But they did not only not protect their communities; they joined UMNO in pursuit of wealth many times for their own personal being at the expense of the rights of their communities.
As a Chinese or Indian Malaysian, you are now a second class citizen in this country born 51 years ago, left betrayed, unprotected and to fend for themselves on their own. Muslim Indonesians and Filipinos are made to feel welcome. Many get citizenships ostensibly to increase the Muslim majority.
But our guardians, MCA and MIC, still looked on squeezing it’s minorities virtually to leave this country. So that promise of 1957 was made to be broken. Or was it sabotaged along the way with the help of the MCA, MIC and later Gerakan.
Governance of the former Federated states had changed hands from our British colonial masters to UMNO. And no one was going to do anything about it.
Enter the Pakatan Rakyat. An inexperienced alternative composite of disparate parties who have significantly changed the political landscape. In the states of Penang, Perak and Selangor, they are beginning to show that even inexperienced administrators, given time may be able to deliver.
PAS on the hand appears fixated on relatively petty matters such as Islamic law when economy, education and health should be right on top of the agenda. But mathematically it is not possible for PAS to ever pass these laws.
Even, if they tried, the reassuring pronouncements of Karpal Singh has brought immense confidence to people like me , that in the event that PAS trys to pull a fast one, the DAP will pull out of the coalition causing the fragmentation and fall of the Federal government if they happen to form one.
This confidence far outstrips the current and ongoing blatant sell out of their communities by the MIC and MCA to UMNO, not that race based politics matter anymore.
Yes as a Chinese, I will vote in PAS anytime, anywhere in this country, because with the Pakatan Rakyat I can rest assured that the law as spelled out in our constitution will reign supreme, and pretenders like PAS will be stopped right in their tracks by the DAP unlike the shenanigans at the MIC and MCA who have now brought minorities to their knees by deceiving them of their rights by colluding with UMNO.
It was the British spy; Harold Philby who once said that “To betray you must first belong.” By belonging, the MCA, MIC and Gerakan have never hesitated for a minute to make full use of their belonging to betray and condemn their communities to a bleak and uncertain future.
#1 by Godfather on Monday, 19 January 2009 - 1:11 pm
This is heresy which cannot go unanswered by Limkamput and Lee Wang Yen !
#2 by Bobster on Monday, 19 January 2009 - 1:20 pm
Well done Pakatan Rakyat especially PAS in KT Election!
Very glad to see the fruit of our donation being put to good use.
Will continue to donate to ensure the corrupted deceptive regime which is worst the Zionist being put to an end in this nation.
(who else in the country who will rob from the poors and celebrate while the rest of the country suffer, punish own citizens and be merry, even Zionist wouldn’t do that!)
#3 by k1980 on Monday, 19 January 2009 - 1:33 pm
As students in the 70s, we studied ancient Greek, Roman, Chinese and Hindu civilizations during History lessons, along with the origins of Hinduism, Confucianism, Taoism, Judaism, Christianity and Islam( the world’s youngest religion). Today’s students no longer study them any longer. It seems that all the great civilizations and religions have been dumped in favour of one from Arabia. The burning of books on the above subjects will start soon.
#4 by OrangRojak on Monday, 19 January 2009 - 1:35 pm
It’s a pity you use ‘First Past The Post’ in Malaysia, instead of Proportional Representation. I guess a worry for voters in a deeply-divided nation is that a vote might be mistaken for an endorsement of policy.
I wonder how Malaysians might have used their votes in KT if Proportional Representation was used to select a new MP. I’ve wondered about the possibility of a ‘vote against’ before (a vote which would be deducted from the indicated party, rather than added) – would Malaysians use one?
#5 by pulau_sibu on Monday, 19 January 2009 - 1:49 pm
My friends, something even worse are going on in Sarawak. We have a master worse than Mahathir. Basically his whole family is involved in milking Sarawak, and Sarawak has more wealth to be milked. Sarawakians are less aware of democracy, freedom and their own rights. The infrastructures, education, living standard, job opportunities,…. are well behind the Peninsular
#6 by taiking on Monday, 19 January 2009 - 1:59 pm
Yes k1980 somehow school subjects then equip us with a wider general knowledge then today. History books then are truly about things historical and they are very interesting. Now school kids learn only local history with emphasis on glorifying umno and umnoputras. Even hang tuah has been effaced.
#7 by k1980 on Monday, 19 January 2009 - 2:02 pm
Dear pulau_sibu, I believe the Bruneians are laughing themselves silly and thanking Almighty God for having the intelligence not to join Malaysia in 1963. Otherwise what they would get from their oil wealth is a few paltry ringgit under the Wang Ehsan scheme. Apart from having to pay income tax and outrageous prices for electricity and petrol.
#8 by FY Lim on Monday, 19 January 2009 - 2:13 pm
That’s why MCA is called a ” towkay party ” where the leaders fight for their own interest and pockets. UMNO is smart that they will allow a small group in MCA benefit but at the same time be subservient.
Till today, the bleak scenario is the same as the group that runs the leadership of MCA will milk the cream and the opponent group is sidelined. Where in the world will MCA or for that matter Gerakan fight for the interested groups they represent.
The interest of the Chinese had been sold by the MCA and Gerakan leaders and along the way a lot of them migrated overseas.
Look at the way the bully was enacted. The ex-CM of Penang was humiliated right before the public eyes by having his official picture stomped and torn. No respect accorded and these bully got off scot-free. What was the reaction ? Silent as mouse from MCA and Gerakan and PBRS and PBS leaders.
Serves them right as they are the hamba of the tuans.
This is what Lee Wang Yen and Jeffery want to see.
#9 by cintanegara on Monday, 19 January 2009 - 2:17 pm
In this country, no one has ever considered as second-class citizen. It is just a propaganda brought by the oppositions to gain support and political mileage. Unlike the other country which DAP adores very much, Malaysia appears to be more fair and transparent in terms of equality of opportunity regardless of race, ethnicity, or religion. That’s why our PM has never declared that Malaysia is not ready for a minority PM.
Furthermore, minister posts are allocated among various ethnic groups and some of them even hold senior positions in the cabinet. In Malaysia, it is not something unusual to see the minority ethnics fly the Fighter jet.
#10 by GreenBug on Monday, 19 January 2009 - 2:40 pm
Yes, as a Chinese, I too would vote for PAS over UMNO, MCA, MIC or Gerakan anytime.
#11 by 9to5 on Monday, 19 January 2009 - 2:45 pm
I would say rather qualify myself by saying, “Don’t vote for PAS blindly”!
Take a lesson from the KT chinese – they are the wisest chinese you’ll ever find!
They knew PAS was going to win the by-election. It doesn’t matter that much if PAS wins by 2,631 votes or 10,631 votes. When UMNO comes with gifts bearing aplenty, they took the gifts. But they took from UMNO and gave some away to the oppositions to support their cause. They voted for BN with an “eye-wink to DAP and Keadilan”. So when UMNO lost the election, they can have the excuse that it is their own fault – they failed to secure the malay votes not the chinese. They gave a little lifeline to UMNO and MCA but only a little; just enough for UMNO and MCA to survive a little longer and return with more goodies and better treatment for the chinese all over.
To give PAS an overwhelming win of 10,631 votes would be to give them too much face such that they could take the chinese for granted and they can go around claiming that the chinese do not mind hudud and islamic laws being imposed on them. So they gave PAS a little support but not too much as to render their support cheap and worthless.
That way UMNO and PAS can tussle for the chinese votes. That way the chinese value will rocket to moon! DAP and Keadilan just don’t know how huge the KT chinese have done the favour to them by voting for BN with a “eye-wink to DAP and Keadilan”!
#12 by hadi on Monday, 19 January 2009 - 2:54 pm
Why as a Malay I will always vote for DAP. Coz I am a Malaysian and I know what the party is doing!!!
#13 by Lee HS on Monday, 19 January 2009 - 2:55 pm
With UMNO helming the country for 51 years, Malaysia is sliding into oblivion. People have been fooled for so long. With the advent of internet, suddenly Malaysians wake up to the reality that UMNO is actually the consists of a buch of people selling off Malaysian future.
No wonder these sickening Malaysia politicians always want to divide the population along the racial line. I am sure older Malaysians are living happier during our period as compared to now. Everything is so divided be it in education, cultures, religions and geography. The Malays still want to flock amongst themselves. The Chinese will try to avoid Malay dominated areas. We will avoid each other as far as possible. These are signs of hopelessness for a country. If these trend prolong, Malaysia will be a failed state like a lot of Muslim countries in the world.
UMNO has been using racial card to play the sentiments of the population to their tune. They control the media and yet the media is supposed to be run by people with high educational level. With our educational level in the doldrums, we can’t expect the media people to give any constructive view.
With KT by-election vistory for the PR, I hope Malayisan masses have woken up to the reality that we cannot survive alone and segregated like Robinson Crusoe.
#14 by waterfrontcoolie on Monday, 19 January 2009 - 3:01 pm
Having involved in local associations including trade units, I find that Asians in general [ maybe exceptions of Japanese and Koreans, I leave to you all ] certainly like to compromise principles whenever the situation benefit them. Pulau-Sibu certainly support situation whenever it goes along his thoght. cintanegara likewise bases his principles on racial ground. Whenever, his type fails to compete or comprehend a situation, he conveniently pushes the blame to any party who is no where near the issue under discussion.
This is very similiar to TDM’s stand. He now blames AAB for all the corrupt practices in this country!! Wouldn’t that be the biggest joke of the century? Why do we need to poke our southern neighbour? We failed to make use of all our sources to build up our position through cronyism and absolute corruption, is this our act or did we practice them through others’ influence??
If we cannot take care of our own house and deliberately set it on fire and our neighbour fails to help; who do we blame in the first instance? It has been the maxim of the current leadership to find fault outside its sphere of responsiblity. Failing which GOD should be blamed!! We created all this mess, so do not envy others, all we need to do is to put our house in order. The world does not owe Malaysians a living!!
#15 by pulau_sibu on Monday, 19 January 2009 - 3:02 pm
I prefer PAS compared to UMNO. PAS is more religious compared to UMNO who just used Islam to gain own benefit. What UMNO is practising, like corruption, supressing the rights of human being, etc., are totally against teaching of Islam. Islam is a beautiful religion if you understand it properly. I myself enjoy learning about Islamic culture, visiting places where Islamic kingdom was once the greatest in the 7th-14th century,…I have been to many mosques over the world.
Islam and Christianity are two closest religions, putting aside some of the minor differences. They originated from the same bible and same story (Judaism and Islam are much more closer than Islam-Christianity). Even for some Chinese, we have to realise that Hinduism and Buddism are also very close. Buddism is derived from Hinduism, but most people did not realise it because they did not want to know about the real history.
In boleh, UMNO was able to segregate the people and using the religions to divide the people.
#16 by Prasad on Monday, 19 January 2009 - 3:02 pm
Hey cintanegara, NEP by default makes non-Malays second class citizen. What BS (Transparency ,equality of opportunity regardless of race.) you are trying to feed us.
Hey NEP is based on Race and connection to UMNO. It is not based on the economic state of an individual.
#17 by Jeffrey on Monday, 19 January 2009 - 3:19 pm
I wonder whether an ideological purist or Ulama in PAS will appreciate the vote/support of Chinese along lines stated by Jonathan Tan!
For the support is not based on acceptance of Hudud/Islamic theocratic state. It is based on the calculations that “ mathematically it is not possible for PAS to ever pass these laws” and “even, if they tried …the DAP will pull out of the coalition causing the fragmentation and fall of the Federal government if they (PAS) happen to form one”.
In a word, the Chinese support is opportunistic.
Chinese as are all other Malaysians face the following options in the Pakatan Rakyat equation: 1. UMNO’s Status Quo, 2. PKR/DAP Reformasi or 3. PAS Theocratic Islamization?
Support for PR, and a vote for PAS candidate is based on the formula of tolerating 3 in order to realise the expedience of ridding off (1) imediately in order for 2. to prevail over 3. with the capturing of Federal government.
The formula assumes:
Firstly, the prospect of being able to capture of Federal Government will attract crossovers from other parties equally antithical to 3. as PKR/DAP. This is not to count the broad middle class and moderates of all races, NGOs and Civil Society (including Sisters-in Islam) will resist PAS’s agenda, and that along with whatever that is left of BN then in opposition, there will not be the requisite 2/3 majority to change the Federal Constitution to bring it in line with PAS’s objectives;
Secondly, in fielding candidates whether for next by elections or general election, the numbers of PAS’s candidates fielded by PAS under PR would not be more and more relative to PKR and DAP;
Thirdly, PAS will not be able to assert its influence more and more in states won by PR in which PAS is not majority in the state assemblies;
Fourthly, by collaborating with other PR’s partners to eject BN, PAS will not be able to define more and more the Malay Ground as being divided between only the BN’s policies and PAS’s Theocratic/Hudud policies with no place in between for PKR’s/DAP’s existing policies.
[Here policy of Anwar’s/PKR that tilt the balance of two against one is problemetic, for one is never sure where Anwar stands at the critical juncture. He is on record in the KT by election as saying that he had no problem with PAS’s Hudud where it is applied to Muslims. This is no consolation for even in a “purer” Islamic theocracy like Saudi Arabia, Iran or Taliban Afghanistan, I don’t believe Hudud is applicable to non Muslims. So where ‘s the consolation???]
PAS strategists are also thinking and planning on how to neutralise the above assumptions. They believe that time and demographics are on their side : so are determination and tactical moves as well as receptivity of Malay/Muslim constituency in the longer run.
So you hedge your bets – who will prevail in due course, PAS strategic plan or the other “opportunistic” plan!
#18 by Jeffrey on Monday, 19 January 2009 - 3:37 pm
“The ex-CM of Penang was humiliated right before the public eyes by having his official picture stomped and torn. No respect accorded and these bully got off scot-free. What was the reaction ? Silent as mouse from MCA and Gerakan and PBRS and PBS leaders. Serves them right as they are the hamba of the tuans.
This is what Lee Wang Yen and Jeffery want to see.”- FY Lim posted Today at 14: 13.42 (1 hour ago).
To FY Lim : You are different, you don’t like to see that? if so, why?
#19 by Lee Wang Yen on Monday, 19 January 2009 - 3:41 pm
Many think that PAS is unlikely to implement Hudud even if PR replaces BN. One of the key considerations is the rough parity of seats that are likely to be won by each of the three PR component parties. Let’s not question this assumption for the moment.
Suppose PR sustains its momentum and wrests control of the federal government in the next general election by winning around 120 of the 222 seats (assuming that there is no increase in total seats). On the assumption of the rough parity of seats among PR component parties, PKR, DAP and PAS each wins about 40 seats. Let’s suppose that PAS gains most of its additional seats from UMNO (about 17), PKR mostly from MCA in mixed constituencies and MIC, and some East Malaysian parties, and that DAP mostly from MCA in Chinese-majority seats, SUPP, GERAKAN and some other East Malaysian parties.
Suppose PAS pushes for a hudud which it claims is only applicable to Muslims. Given that Anwar has already said that there is no problem with a hudud that only applies to Muslims, PKR is likely to support it.
So there are 80 votes for Hudud.
Suppose UMNO wins 60 seats in next election and supports the hudud bill tabled by PAS in the parliament. There are now 140 votes. If 8 Muslim MPs from East Malaysia vote for the bill, there will be 148.
Is it as unlikely as many of us would like to think?
#20 by dawsheng on Monday, 19 January 2009 - 3:46 pm
“Even, if they tried, the reassuring pronouncements of Karpal Singh has brought immense confidence to people like me , that in the event that PAS trys to pull a fast one, the DAP will pull out of the coalition causing the fragmentation and fall of the Federal government if they happen to form one.” – Jonathan Tan
Something is not right with this statement, while it is not entirely wrong but one thing is clear, there is no assurance whatsoever. It sounds like a joke!
#21 by limkamput on Monday, 19 January 2009 - 3:50 pm
On the surface it seems so well said. Just a number of points for the grand uncle and others to consider:
1. Karpal Singh is not going to live forever. People his stature is hard to come by.
2. Yes, to betray you must first belong. DAP has not belonged yet because they have not fully tasted power and privileges.
3. It is so simplistic to assert that PAS will be stopped at their tracks. What is the difference when one (UMNO) is based on race while the other (PAS) is based on religion.
4. Between race and religion, religion is even more assertive. Race is just one dimensional. In Malaysia, religion has two.
#22 by limkamput on Monday, 19 January 2009 - 4:01 pm
One of the greatest hoax is that political parties selling on the platform of religion will be more pious. How stupid some of us can be, grow up lah, for goodness sake. Religions have been used for thousands of years and will be reused in the future.
#23 by Kelvenho on Monday, 19 January 2009 - 4:13 pm
I fully agree with what Jonathan Tan says. We need change for a
better gorvernment. I am looking forward to this change.
As for the MCA and Gerakan I believe they have lost the Chinese
support since ” 308 “.
#24 by wanderer on Monday, 19 January 2009 - 4:23 pm
cintanegara, if you stayed in your kampong and behaved like a kampong kid, your brain stays undeveloped and stagnant, only your mouth oozes out rubbish!
Let me enlighten you these facts. In White Australia, where the Asian numbered is less than 10% of its population and 20% of others, everyone is treated fairly and equally…even PR holders. University places are given on merits, health care offer to everyone and subsidized medicine to all retirees and students.Jobs given without prejudice and everyone is welcome to be a citizen once qualified. So what have you to be so proud about, cintanegara?
I revisit Malaysia after 30 years absence, the same old tune is played. Now the PM in waiting is the chip of the old, how frightening and disappointing!
I will ignore PAS during my younger days but now confidently, vote PAS and PKR for change.
#25 by Mr Smith on Monday, 19 January 2009 - 4:45 pm
How true, Jonathan.
I saw the changes taking place and in the early 70s I realized that the future would be real bleak for my children and my children’s children if this country remained under BN.
I prepared them to leave the country and seek greener pastures elsewhere. Why? Because the MCA and MIC were also selling out their own people. Whom do we trust to protect our interests.
?
What puzzled me was the Chinese and Indians were continuing to support the MCA and MIC?
I voted for DAP in eight general elections as I would be betraying my family and country by voting for BN. This country is doomed under BN.
I saw this coming 40 years ago.
If BN falls, I will reconsider the ‘migratory’ thoughts.
#26 by OrangRojak on Monday, 19 January 2009 - 4:56 pm
Lee Wang Yen: there will be 148
If there’s a majority, there’s a majority. It’s a democracy, so the majority will get what they want. Are you assuming that BN, knowing that a majority of the electorate (and hence supporters of the next government) would vote for Hudud, would say no to it on principle? You’re not, of course. I think what you’re suggesting is that the vote is for ‘absolutely anything but BN’ and Hudud or some other outcome you fear will come in on that tide.
I’ve made the same comment you’ve just made – it’s an obvious scenario, against which there’s no strategy except to try to impose something other than democracy. Democracy doesn’t guarantee anything good, only that citizens get to influence what happens to a degree based on how many people they can recruit to their side. If most of the people want something you don’t like, you get to wear a sad face. Most of the alternatives to democracy probably only increase the number of sad faces in a population.
There is another strategy, of course, and that is to launch another political party, field candidates in every electoral area, become wildly popular and win the next election, perhaps inviting the pick of the crop of losers to join your government. I’d probably vote for that, but I can’t vote. I think some of my neighbours would vote for that, but they’ll never know anything about it. The national media carries no news of alternatives unless it’s to deride them. What are you left with? The pulpit? It’s a majority Muslim country. I think if you tried that, you’d be up against one of the more ‘sensitive’ parts of the Constitution.
There’s another risk, of course: that you give it your best shot, do exceptionally well for a new party and divide the ‘vote against BN’ vote so that BN are the new government again. You would be lynched!
Are you ‘testing the water’ anywhere else on the Internet? How is it going? You’d probably have to assume that some people will reject your idea purely on the ‘split vote’ prospect, but would vote if they saw sufficient momentum building. I don’t think Malaysia is ready for a gamble like that, but then again, I don’t think there’s any trend in that direction.
#27 by pulau_sibu on Monday, 19 January 2009 - 5:11 pm
Communism which once controlled more than half of Europe and major parts of Asia COLLAPSED. Corruption, dictatorship and inefficiency of government were the major reason. If the people could be happy, the system would continue to survive. After half a century, the great communism collapsed. So there is no way that UMNOism should remain unchallenged and remain in bolehland. The collapse is a matter of time.
It is not widely mentioned, but we do see that UMNO leaders are now sons and grandsons or relatives of former politicians. If you are not one of those noble families, your chance will never come. UMNO and Malaysian politics are controlled by a handful of people, who absolutely have no credentials.
#28 by cintanegara on Monday, 19 January 2009 - 5:15 pm
The other country does it well too to minority ethnic….They have been systematically marginalized and discriminated by the Government ….Look at their present Government….only 1 minister from a particular ethnic, despite having a composition of 14% of the country population….
#29 by Godfather on Monday, 19 January 2009 - 5:18 pm
cintanegara, why are you constantly deflecting attention from your masters’ shenanigans to another country ? No proper rebuttals, so you start pointing to another country’s ills ?
Just like Mamakthir justifying suicide bombings against Israel and the Americans because of “hard luck, poverty and hopelessness” ?
#30 by Godfather on Monday, 19 January 2009 - 5:21 pm
cintanegara:
so this country you refer to marginalises its minorities, so UMNO is fully justified in marginalising Bolehland’s minorities ? Want APs to continue into 2020 ? Want Eurocopters ? Want new airport at Labu ?
UMNO tak cukup makan lagi ?
#31 by Loh on Monday, 19 January 2009 - 5:23 pm
///Suppose UMNO wins 60 seats in next election and supports the hudud bill tabled by PAS in the parliament.///
UMNO will not support Hudud while it is in the opposition side because it will not be able to tell the AG to drop cases.
#32 by Bobster on Monday, 19 January 2009 - 5:39 pm
308 and 117 indicated that the rakyat’s mentality has changed but unfortunately not the ruling coalitions and cronies.
The people of this nation need to be more patient to see the country transforms through the ‘restructuring’ stage.
Sure there will be few jokers here and there from Pakatan Rakyat (as well as from this forum) appear during the process of ‘restructuring’ but people have to be persistent and be patience to see things develop over time. Look far rather than be short sighted and prefer to retrieve back to own cocoon.
Give Pakatan Rakyat a chance to strengthen to be on par with BN in terms of control over the federal government.
The country needs a similar democratic system like in US with balance support between Republican and Democrat to have check and balance. Bush did a lousy job so kick him out and Democrat takes over.
Over here we can’t even kick a corrupt officer out due to some link to cronies.
51 yrs is enough for a nation to mature. We don’t want to see another 50 yrs to screw the nation into bankruptcy.
Give Pakatan at least 2 terms is fair to judge their performance failure which they will be kicked out and replace with the BN cronies.
Resistence to change is so great including some in the forum (you be wondering whether they are people elected ‘cyber troopers’).
Hudud and race cards being played around by few jokers here and there to deceive the majority so that they can continue to screw the nation from the back.
So the question is:- Are the rakyat prepare to create a NEW MALAYSIA by the next GE?
I as a citizen of this nation will like to see that!
Well done Pakatan Rakyat!
#33 by k1980 on Monday, 19 January 2009 - 6:38 pm
George W Bush’s eulogy: stolen elections, corporate greed, fraud and corruption, unlimited spending, wealth redistribution (to the top), no checks and balances, rampant militarization, the destruction of Iraq, permanent war, and unquantifiable, unrepayable national debt.
What will Dollah’s eulogy be like?
#34 by NOT DUMB MALAYSIAN on Monday, 19 January 2009 - 6:58 pm
PASS NO LONGER BOGEY
PAS is no longer a boeyman
Saudara Lim, Why underline that as a Chinese you will always vote PAS> As a rational Malaysian of ??? descent, I have and WILL vote PAS. We don’t have to prescribe the Chinese formula as being non-racist or non-sectarian to vote PAS. Christans/Buddhists. What the hect? To do so will suck us into the BN culture.
#35 by kcb on Monday, 19 January 2009 - 7:14 pm
Guys, let cintanegara continue to sleep. Let’s not awake him from his slumber by responding to his post.
#36 by ahduii_ck on Monday, 19 January 2009 - 7:14 pm
Dear cintanegara…how can you compare a country that only has 1 minister together with Malaysia?In that country, all minorities are treated equally regardless of race, gender and religion. There’s no need at all to have anyone from a particular community to protect its own community as all are treated equally. If you dont mind telling us how the minorities are systematically marginalized?
#37 by ktteokt on Monday, 19 January 2009 - 7:15 pm
If it is Hudud that the Chinese fear, then whether they vote for PAS or for BN makes no difference since both of them intend to set up Islamic nations in Malaysia and UMNO has already declared that Malaysia IS an Islamic nation!
So what is there to fear anymore! Voting in favour of UMNO or BN would mean the continuance of corruption, mismanagement of the nation’s resources and more bullying. There is still hope in voting for PAS.
#38 by monsterball on Monday, 19 January 2009 - 7:18 pm
Great write up!
Let young educated voters read…do not simply believe. Ask questions and seek truths. .with their own good brains.
I have lived through history…and what Jonathan Tan said…are simple plain truth.
I like the last paragraph .. about MCA.
#39 by NOT DUMB MALAYSIAN on Monday, 19 January 2009 - 8:26 pm
KT: UMNO IN ABJECT STATE OF DENIAL
Barisan Nasional has been humiliated at the polls for the third time in ten months. I am full of admiration for the hardworking party members who toiled for two weeks on a local struggle. But we lost because of a national problem. The rakyat reject UMNO in its present form and style, and they reject its leadership.
Despite ringing signals from the rakyat through March 8 and Permatang Pauh, UMNO either has not heard the call for fundamental change, or is unable to respond to it.
Money, machinery and incumbency could not trump the call for change. BN will lose, and will in the end lose everything, until we respond fully and sincerely. But the response from the leadership yet again is that this “should not be interpreted as voters having spurned BN.” Our leadership remains in denial. Loyal members of UMNO and the BN will feel they are on a sinking ship.
UMNO has lost by a large majority in a 90% Malay constituency. We lost because of Malay votes in a state whose government we control. We threw the national resources of a party in Federal power at this election, and still we lost.
Actually this was more than a referendum on the leadership. It was a test of the relevance of UMNO in its present form. If UMNO is no longer relevant to the Malays, the BN formula is dead. The Chinese will have no reason to support MCA, and so on. The power-sharing, consensual bargain on which our political system has been based since Independence is broken.
There are serious implications to this. We have always claimed that social peace in Malaysia is built on this bargain. A party leadership in denial is unlikely to form a government with the realism and guts to face an economic meltdown that it also denies is happening. We are in uncharted waters with no one at the wheel.
#40 by drngsc on Monday, 19 January 2009 - 10:05 pm
Right, anything but UMNO / BN. Enough is enough.
#41 by vsp on Monday, 19 January 2009 - 10:24 pm
History has shown that the powerful, whether it be an empire, a nation, a king, or an individual will never change even though they have suffered setbacks upon setbacks along the journey to their decline. The powerful will always rationalise and manipulate their declining power in trying to show that they are still powerful.
It’s no different from what UMNO is behaving now. Not to underestimate UMNO, UMNO is still a colossus as far as Malaysian politics is concerned. Throughout the years it has accumulated powers by any means, through foul and manipulative methods through the subversion of the Constitution and consolidating its hold on power through malicious constitutional means. As long it is still in power UMNO can do a lot of damage in order to crush its enemies.
By the nature of Malaysian federal-state relationship, power is totally concentrated in the centre and whoever controls the centre will always have an upper hand.
So even though Pakatan is the government in 5 states, the BN can still blithely ignore the situation. Pakatan is still a toothless tiger. It has no control over development funds, of the civil service, the police, the courts and so on. Malaysian democracy is still very primitive unlike in mature democracies where power is devolved among the provinces or states.
We have seen how the BN has diverted development funds from Pakatan states, has used the police to intimidate the state government in matters of security and even arrest some of its officials; have instructed the state education and tourism departments to ignore the directives of the state government; the state government cannot even sack incompetent civil servants; it does not have the cooperation of the state police to fight crimes; and it cannot direct the AG to prosecute past leaders who were corrupted even though it has the evidence. So the Pakatan government is basically working under excruciating handicaps imposed upon it by the federal government.
Do you think that with such absolute power in its hands UMNO will see the need for change? Just imagine how many trillions (not billions) it has milked from the country. With every project that were jacked up 5–10 times their actual cost, no wonder even though Malaysia is blessed with so many resources, it still lagged behind Singapore, a country which is very resource-poor. Do you think that they will give up such such easy pickings?
Yes, UMNO will never change because it is invested with awesome powers to do whatever it pleases. Change for UMNO will be very painful and it would rather not.
Some of the people out there who still think that Pakatan can do wonders, consider the points that I have listed above. If you still can’t understand, then you are just plain ignorant and naïve, political-wise. I prefer that the BN still go on dreaming.
Pakatan has to assume control of the federal government, and if after achieving this, it cannot improve the country’s lot then it deserves to be kicked out.
#42 by waterfrontcoolie on Monday, 19 January 2009 - 11:05 pm
Having read Lee Wang Yen for so long, his basic thought on faith is as orthodox as his counterparts of other beliefs. One track mind!! Do remember the history of the older civilizations are much , much older than those who think there is only a single path to the Almighty!! So please live and let live! None of us will be able to prove who is right and who is wrong until you are over there! i would sincerely hope that at the end of the day, let everyone finds the path he has decided for himself.
This site will better serves its purpose when more down to earth solutions are discussed to ensure the progress of the country. Do take into consideration that whether you want it or not, Muslims are in the majority. It does mean we are going to accept IMPOSSIBLE edicts; unless we all want to face Armagedon! If you have faith in your belief/ pathway, have no fear, no one can take it away from you! But just don’t think that there is only one pathway!!
#43 by undergrad2 on Monday, 19 January 2009 - 11:08 pm
There is still this pinhead who sits within the comfort of his study thousands of miles away, with a calculator in hand and armed with his logical thinking skills, insists on impressing readers of his skill in computing the probability of a bill being passed which would convert the country into an Islamic state, ignorant of the fact that it is not within the jurisdiction of the federal parliament to legislate on issues regarding religion (read: Islam).
His ignorance becomes all the more obvious when he gives the Malays little credit as moderate Muslims who have for years rejected religious extremism. It is not like PAS hasn’t been around for some fifty years. During much of this period, PAS has been unpopular with the Malays and has been rejected by the Malays in preference for UMNO. The majority of the Malays are conservative moderates when it comes to their religion. There is always the vocal minority.
Malays are allowing PAS their day in the sun today partly because UMNO has disappointed them, and because inter alia they have matured politically as an electorate and would like to see a stronger dose of democracy and freedom, and an end to the abuse of power and corruption which has permeated BN (read: UMNO) administration – and because PKR to these disgruntled supporters of UMNO is all about Anwar Ibrahim who earlier sold out his soul during his meteoric rise to power to become the country’s No. 2 man. They are not against UMNO’s policy regarding wealth redistribution since they are the undisputed beneficiaries of such a policy (though its implementation in more recent years is somewhat skewed to benefit the politically connected) but merely choose PAS as a vehicle to vent their anger and frustration at the rampant corruption and abuse of power.
UMNO when reformed, purged of corrupt elements and re-energized will no doubt be the magnet it once was for moderate Malay Muslims including those now with PKR. PAS today seems to have made a break with history to be less a symbol of village politics that it once was. But under PAS, there will be setbacks, false starts and mistakes because they don’t have the large pool of talent and skills and experience needed to successfully administer states under their control. What it has is not much more than a crop of visionary leaders driven by ideology.
The flirtation with the concept of the Islamic state is a reflection of how important and central the constitutional position of Islam is in the lives of the religiously conservative Malays but that’s what it all is – a flirtation.
#44 by cemerlang on Monday, 19 January 2009 - 11:19 pm
Like Tun Mahathir said. The people support the Pakatan Rakyat because they are angry with the Barisan Nasional. As for the hudud laws, it will be best if they are applied for the Muslims only. Malaysians who have gone to the Middle East to work are happy with the fat salaries there and do not seem to mind the dress code and other Islamic laws. Same too in Kelantan where non Muslims somehow can get along with the Muslims. So where do we go from here ? Presently, Pakatan Rakyat is more like an auditor, auditing whatever the Barisan Nasional is doing.
#45 by Godfather on Monday, 19 January 2009 - 11:45 pm
Undergrad2: You mean our Cambridge friend’s flirtation with a new third force (which he called PD) has no chance in this society ? I mean, this is a guy who hasn’t voted, and may not even be a registered voter, but he talks like he has so much at stake in this country with his endless permutations of doomsday.
#46 by wanderer on Monday, 19 January 2009 - 11:52 pm
cintanegara;
Due to your ignorance, allow me to educate you further so as to wipe the lie you have posted in your comment. Australia has about 10% Asian of which 6% are Chinese. In that 6% only 8% are Australia born, the rest are new migrants. Only 60% took up Australian citizenship. We are represented with 1 MP, which is not too bad as new comers!
After 51 years of Merdeka, what have your UMNO done to promote racial integration…only harping all the time on Katuanan melayu.
What so Katuanan about your UMNO malay…well known thieves, robbers, twisters and liars?
#47 by lkt-56 on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 12:42 am
Kit,
I guess that you posted this article because you wanted to assure Chinese voters that it is alright to vote for PAS because it is unlikely that they will be able to implement Hudud laws and if they try DAP will stop them even if it means taking the party out of the coalition.
The responses to this article, I noted is overwhelmingly along communal thoughts. Dr. Mahathir is right. Communal politics is still relevant… unfortunately.
Allow me to point out that the “political tsunami” of March 2008 and the so called second tsunami in KT is as much about the current administration’s relentless march towards losing its mandate to rule due to:-
1) Using the mandate given by the people to benefit a select few who walks the corridors of power or have links to those who walks the corridors of power.
2) Using the mandate given by the people to put certain communities at a disadvantage for too long (the reason why communal parties in the administration are losing their support).
3) Using the mandate given by the people to use unjust laws (ISA, eg) to stifle dissenting views…. the list goes on.
The point I am trying to make is:
1) That it is not about Hudud
2) It is not about Chinese or Malay or Indian
3) It is not about religion
IT IS ACTUALLY ABOUT USING THE POWER BESTOWED ON THE RULER (THE ANCIENT CHINESE CALLS IT “MANDATE OF HEAVEN”) TO GOVERN SUCH THAT NO ONE IS PUT AT A DISADVANTAGE. THE ADMINISTRATION THAT CAN TRULY GOVERN WITH SINCERITY AND PUTS THE INTERESTS OF HER CITIZENS WILL BE ENDURING.
We are about to see Pakatan Rakyat winning this mandate. Does the leadership of PR truly appreciate what is the cause of the current administrations decline?
#48 by undergrad2 on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 1:47 am
Godfather Says:
Yesterday at 23: 45.01
Undergrad2: You mean our Cambridge friend’s flirtation with a new third force (which he called PD) has no chance in this society ? I mean, this is a guy who hasn’t voted, and may not even be a registered voter, but he talks like ….”
This guy is so paranoid about the prospect of losing his foreskin that he couldn’t think rationally – and this guy has a PhD? I think the University should consider taking away those letters and have them replaced with something more fitting like a diploma in irrational thinking.
#49 by undergrad2 on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 2:01 am
Godfather,
This guy is so afraid that they might drop his pants to his ankles and expose his buttocks to the public to be caned for exercising his constitutional rights! That is not gonna happen and you do not have to have a PhD to know that!
#50 by computation on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 4:21 am
pulau_sibu
i do not know what you mean by
“Islam and Christianity are two closest religions, putting aside
some of the minor differences”
there is at least one major critical difference between
islam and christianity. it is not a minor difference.
#51 by computation on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 5:28 am
cintanegara
you see in malaysia it is not
difficult to see people from “minority
groups” flying fighter jets because maybe they
is a shortage of people from the “majority
group” who can.
we certainly don’t want expensive aeroplanes
to be falling out of the sky do we?
perhaps in that tiny red dot there is no
shortage among the “majority group” there
who can…
#52 by computation on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 5:35 am
cintanegara says
“The other country does it well too to minority ethnic….They
have been systematically marginalized and discriminated by the
Government ….Look at their present Government….only 1 minister
from a particular ethnic, despite having a composition of 14% of
the country population….”
the fact that the minority group only have
1 minister in the government does not mean
they are marginalized and discriminated against.
it just means the minority group there doesn’t have
more people of the calibre suitable to serve
in the cabinet. the malay minister in question
in the singapore cabinet has a phd from standford.
the rest of the singapore cabinet is filled with
people who are no less intelligent. the finance
and law ministers are of tamil or indian origin.
considering that these are very important ministries
in fact the top two most important ministries.
and the indians are also in the minority there
i see no evidence that the tiny red dot practises
discrimination. i assure you the chinese
in singapore are more fair minded then the malays
in power in malaysia.
#53 by computation on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 5:36 am
erm stanford… engineering degree…
#54 by computation on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 5:39 am
erm
considering that these are very important ministries
in fact the top two most important ministries along with
fact that the indians are also in the minority there…
#55 by computation on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 5:42 am
i also assure you that in that tiny red dot,
should a chinese make remarks about running
a malay through with a sword he will be dealt with
most severely by the prime minister of that little
tiny weeny red dot.
#56 by computation on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 5:43 am
erm
the fact that the minority group only has…
#57 by computation on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 5:43 am
erm
the fact that a certain minority group only has…
#58 by computation on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 5:46 am
i wonder if malaysia will have
a non-malay finance or law minister again…
cintanegara respond!
#59 by computation on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 6:12 am
oh i forgot to mention
in that inconsequential tiny
red dot one of the deputy prime
ministers is from a “minority group”
malaysia?? and is the malaysian deputy minister
one in whom malaysians can take pride in?
come on lah…
#60 by computation on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 6:31 am
oh whilst we are about it
perhaps malaysia can have a non-malay
deputy prime minister?
#61 by Jeffrey on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 6:41 am
American Chinese author Lin Yutang once wrote that God created humans with a bottomless pit- their stomachs. Many take this as a more particular reference to the Chinese who love their food. For last two weeks of KT by election campaign, many Chinese in Kuala Terrengganu gained a bit of weigh t as they were taken to gastronomic heights by the endless cycle of dinners thrown by the MCA/Gerakan and the DAP.
The menu of BN parties’ dinners was a better fare: crystal prawns, “kampung chicken” etc with “ang pows” for CNY from the hosts. The DAP’s dinners were humbler (which is understandable) and instead of getting ang pows, guests were invited on voluntary basis to make donations, if they wished, which many enthusiastically donated, some from a portion of the proceeds from the MCA angpows!
The 2631 majority votes that PAS candidate garnered would have been more if the by election were not held two weeks from CNY. Many of the young working in cities and towns who would otherwise have given their votes to the Opposition did not go back to KT to vote. This is because they would be going back anyway on C NY to see their parents/folks and it made no sense to go back “ twice”, once for the by-election, then another time, a week or so later for CNY!
Pete (RPK) would run his own survey on the ground with Malay folks. He approached an elderly Malay woman and asked Makcik who she would vote for. She said UMNO. He asked why – why not PAS. She said, “cakap, ta’ boleh kah?” She probably thought that he, with his toupee beret, was some foreign recruited agent for Special Branch!
These are some of the problems that BN encountered as its well-oiled electoral machinery with ample resources, advantage of over 1000 postal votes, swooped into town, led by none other than the PM elect…..
Now Kit had complained in this blog on a thread posted Monday, January 5th, 2009 that Datuk Seri Najib Razak should scrupulously observe the distinction between being one of the party leaders in town for the by-election and not as a Deputy Prime Minister or Prime Minister-elect, and in latter capacity take advantage of the resources of the state.
However the “resources” of the state in the form of a horde of police outriders during his visit to Kuala Terengganu proved a minus than a plus point because they caused traffic jams that locals were not accustomed to.
Locals in Terengganu might not be as parochial as Kelantanese but they are also not very much less so. This “invasion” by a horde of police outriders heightened their sense of parochialism and was interpreted as elitism and abuse of power imposed from KL without regard to local sensitivities. PAS house-to -house campaign focusing on oil royalties and Monsoon Cup wasting RM300 million a year of state’s moneys would appeal to this parochial sense!
#62 by Jeffrey on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 8:21 am
After KT by election PR now sets its focus on Sarawak. It is a different ball game from Kuala Terengganu. Demographics : Melanau Muslims 7%, Malay Muslims 21%, 45% Ibans, Bidayuh, Orang Ulu (“Dayaks”), Chinese 26.7% and Indians 0.2%.
UMNO has no presence in Sarawak but notwithstanding it could mould Sarawak politics in BN’s image in Semenjung : ie Taib’s Parti Pesaka Bumiputra Bersatu (PBB), the equivalent of UMNO with a subservient Dayak arm in Pesaka, and a subservient MCA equivalent in SUPP.
PBB is traditionally supported by Melanau Muslims and Malay Muslims. Melanau Muslim leaders are the consummate Machiavellian politicians. Although not more than 10% of population, Melanaus are wealthiest, commercially savvy, politically dominant.
To make inroads into Sarawak, Pakatan Rakyat has to take three pronged broad strategies:
1. Anwar/PKR has to split Sarawak Malay Muslims from Melanau Muslims within PBB and entice the former’s leaders (so far sidelined by Melanaus) with the first go at CM’s position upon PR’s victory (plus other benefits);
2. DAP would of course take a care of Chinese/Indian segment (after all, DAP has last time around gained 6 state seats?)
3. The critical challenge for PR is how to unite and win over Dayaks wallowing in fractious divisiveness. Dayak voters’ support is critical because they’re 45% electorate! The question is what makes them tick. In KT money could not all the time buy votes. But KT is KT, it is not Sibu, Miri, Kuching or interiors of Sarawak!
Many Dayaks live in the vast rural hinterlands of Sarawak, often without basic amenities. Can PR’s ideology of “Ketuanan Rakyat” ameliorate their lot and condition? When it comes to promising promises infrastructure development and funds, roads, jetties, clinics, treated drinking water, and electricity etc can anyone compete with the ruling parties which have lots of past practice, not to mention development or slush funds continuously replenished by natural resources of that state?
In rural hinterland, the BN/PBB clique could afford to charter helicopters across mountains jungles and streams into the not so accessible desolate interior, offer to village headmen food, money, motors for their boats…
This is no Kuala Terengganu. The pivotal question: Has PR – can Anwar raise – the funds to match?
Perhaps those familiar with local Sarawak conditions can shed light of how PR could win over and unite this much divided indigenous community making up 45% of electorate!
#63 by Godfather on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 8:36 am
“This guy is so paranoid about the prospect of losing his foreskin that he couldn’t think rationally – and this guy has a PhD?” Undergrad2
May not be a PhD, could just be an MA,, but whatever the kulitfication is, readers here know now what his pronouncements are all about – extolling the dangers of Islamisation, using history to belittle the achievements of a particular religion – all for a remote possibility, with a low probability. Then he writes long postings to tell us that low probabilities may not be “low” after all.
*sigh* Some kids never learn.
#64 by taiking on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 9:00 am
Cintanegara spoke of marginalisation in one country. He was not forthright about which country but it is quite clear that he is speaking of singapore. I was there for eight years. I could not detect any impartial policies like what we have here. Majority needing protection against minority sort of protection.
There was no policies like our NEP that favour the majority chinese. That are no cries of privilege by the majority. No cries of supremacy by them. No demands for protection of their rights against the minority. No calls for ban on use of minority language (which incidentally malay is their national language) in the name of national unity or creating national identity. No threats of removing malays of their citizenship (something which our umno politicians are stupidly fond of saying). No quota for chinese in universities. Yes. No chinese-only institutions like the world’s best umnoputras-only MARA. And yes no APs and chinese only entitlements like what we have here. No stupid non-legal but still fully enforced FIC requirements.
Its a place where merits and determination count. Having said that malays are given free education is singapore all the way to university. Non-malay singaporeans only get to enjoy free primary education.
The imbalance he cited is the product of meritocracy and hardwork. Of course he being pampared with decades of umno’s unfair and bias and bully tactics now cannot view issues in their correct / proper perspectives. He can only see things through his Tuan McBully vision which is this: Anything which does not favour malays positively are bad. So singapore is bad. US is bad. China is bad, UK is bad. Australia is bad. You name it. There are no NEPs in those countries. That’s why they are all bad.
I am actually glad to know that those views of cintanegara is typical of Tuan McBully only – the umnoputras – and they do not represent the views of the common Joe Ahmad on the street. In fact the educated malays in the peninsular have lost hope in them. I dare the worthy Tuan McBully to say that these malays urban and educated malays are useless and stupid for going opposition’s way.
#65 by Jeffrey on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 9:09 am
We can all disagree (agreeably) without resorting to persistent taunts on personal level, can we not?
#66 by k1980 on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 9:18 am
How will hudud deal with this dirty 84-year-old …?
JITRA: An 84-year-old man was detained on Sunday for allegedly molesting his granddaughter, aged 10, over the past year. He was picked up at his house in Kampung Pasir here after the girl’s 27-year-old mother lodged a police report over the incident. Kubang Pasu deputy police chief Deputy Superintendent Ibrahim Mohd Yusof said a woman had spotted the man lying on his granddaughter and had told him to stop and then informed the girl’s mother about what had happened.
#67 by computation on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 9:26 am
cut off his erm **** ???
you hardly ever here things happening
like that in singapore.
and as far as i know, no policeman
has ever been charged with forcing
girls to perform oral sex…
#68 by computation on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 9:27 am
erm hear things
#69 by computation on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 9:28 am
erm oral sex in the police station
while under detention…
#70 by computation on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 9:29 am
no hudud there
in singapore. nor is it
an islamic state…
wow!
#71 by computation on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 9:30 am
what!!
the malays in singapore get free university education
and the others do not. %!##@! the chinese
are being discriminated against! stupid PAP!
#72 by TheWrathOfGrapes on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 9:31 am
/// # cintanegara Says:
Yesterday at 17: 15.24
The other country does it well too to minority ethnic….They have been systematically marginalized and discriminated by the Government ….Look at their present Government….only 1 minister from a particular ethnic, despite having a composition of 14% of the country population…. ///
cintanegara, glad you bring this up. What has this got to do with marginalization and discrimination? It shows that a particular ethnic just cannot make it under meritocracy. So, what is your idea of meritocracy – promote people based on race? If that race constitute 14% of the population, then 14% of the ministerial posts must go to that race, 14% of the CEOs must be given to that race, 14% of the generals must be from that race, no matter if there are better candidates from the majority and from an even smaller minority. I wonder why you did not mentions Indians in “the other country”. They are doing very well. Many ministers among them, and they are over-represented in the top echelons of society and business.
#73 by Jeffrey on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 10:52 am
TheWrathOfGrapes,
Here, even we ignore Meritocracy and appoint solely based on race as a percentage of population – ie having compulsorily 40% non Malays in government or governmental sector such as ministerial posts, public/civil service, armed and police forces and GLCs – I think maybe 1/2 of nation’s problems will be mitigated. :)
#74 by cintanegara on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 10:58 am
In Malaysia, every citizen enjoys equal opportunities. That’s why we have Pilots from the minority groups flying the fighter jets. It is not that we don’t have talented and capable people from the majority groups to fill up the posts. We trust every of our citizens and their loyalty to the nation…..Yes, Malaysia is a unique country..
#75 by Bigjoe on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 11:19 am
I think PR should not be too happy with the KT result. The Chinese vote did NOT turn enough. Its obvious given the donation to DAP and support to PAS during the campaign that they were not happy with BN but they carrots dangled to them fought back the tide.
If the KT Chinese could be fought back with carrots, the tribes of Sarawak and Sarawak can be similarly fought back and maybe even easier.
PR cannot just show gain in Sarawak and Sabah, they need to pound the daylights out of BN in Sarawak and Sabah and it will take more, much more than the effort in KT to achieve that. PR need to frigten the daylights out of Sarawakians and Sabah. Total fear or disgust is what is going to do it, not promise of a possible better future or a higher ideal of a better govt. Nothing less than loathing for BN is going to do it.
#76 by Godfather on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 11:24 am
cintanegara, yes we have pilots from minority groups flying our airforce jets, but then the lack of meritocracy means that all of them will end up piloting commercial aircraft for better pay and for a non-discriminatory environment. Not ashamed of this brain-drain ?
#77 by computation on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 11:28 am
wah lau
in malaysia every citizen enjoys equal opportunites!
wah lau!
i guess so lah. for the citizens. not
for the pendatangs lah.
#78 by computation on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 11:31 am
wah lau eh!
i cannot tahan this!
#79 by Jeffrey on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 11:36 am
How many pilots of Malaysian fighter jets are from minority groups?
All these fighter jets, you need some English proficiency to read the manual on finer points in an emergency and in the case of MIG-29 19 Skuadron, may be some Russian?
Singapore’s policy then (I don’t know about now) of not engaging Malay Muslim pilots who otherwise may be capable pilots has always been her achilles heels and good fodder for those who attack her allegedly double standard Meritocracy.
To put it matter-of-factly Singapore then took the position (rightly or wrongly) not to subject her fighter pilots to conflicts of interest that could (but necessarily) arise between loyalty and defence of the country on one hand and religious sentiments on the other on the assumption that the counterparty in the conflict is a predominantly Muslim populated country for whom such fighter pilots could feel symapthy.
#80 by king cobra on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 11:37 am
big joe ,
pls visit this website as below:
hope after reading u will know y chinese votes did not swing in pas candidate favor………..
http://mt.m2day.org/2008/content/view/17041/84/
#81 by Lee Wang Yen on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 11:50 am
Godfather has clearly confused the claim that ‘the probability that PR can govern the country or can govern the country effectively is pretty low’ with the CONDITIONAL claim that ‘IF PR suceeded in wresting control of the federal government, the implementation of Hudud would not be as improbable as many here liked to think.’
#82 by Lee Wang Yen on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 11:57 am
To Godfather and Undergrad2,
Your strategy of repeated personal attacks and abuse has worked. I will not come back to comment on this blog.
#83 by OrangRojak on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 12:23 pm
matter-of-factly[ref?]
Is that really a matter of fact, Jeffrey? It sounds too juicy to be true!
not engaging Malay Muslim
So are Oriental (what is the race that ancestrally Chinese people belong to?), Negro, and Caucasian Muslims engaged? Does the government of Singapore profile its citizens (or armed services personnel) according to race and religion?
They could have avoided the religion issue by just employing a few Muslim chaplains in the armed forces like the US and UK do, to remind the pilots that God is on Singapore’s side. Perhaps with a history of high-stakes risk-taking, the people of Singapore know a bad bet when they see one.
#84 by OrangRojak on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 12:29 pm
The UK, teetering on the brink of no longer being a radical religious state itself, didn’t admit non-Christian chaplains to the Armed Forces in 2007, but instead employed civilian chaplains:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/religion/religions/christianity/priests/armychaplains_3.shtml
#85 by computation on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 12:33 pm
yes its true
as lee hsieng loong once said
famously when he was caught off
guard in an interview “we cannot be sure where their
loyalties lie….”
it caused such a storm that subsequent
interviewers where required to submit their
questions in advance of the interview….
#86 by Godfather on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 12:33 pm
Oh dear ! I can’t speak for Undergrad2, but I should think that Cambridge trains its students for the challenges of the real world. The real world isn’t a hunky-dory environment. It’s a dog-eat-dog environment where the fittest survive and the unfit get trampled. We are not dealing with “ifs” and “buts”.
#87 by computation on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 12:35 pm
i was under the impression though
that it only applied to not putting malay
officers in charge of army units which had
heavy machine guns… dont know why
i got that impression.
#88 by cintanegara on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 12:49 pm
How interesting……. certain categories of positions in the Air Force which the minorities ought not to be in? The country tells the entire world it is practicing fair meritocracy…………..However, certain positions still adhering to the race and religion…. Isn’t that a contradicting statement?
#89 by OrangRojak on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 12:50 pm
Your strategy
Nooooo! don’t encourage them! Oh well, too late, I suppose.
respectfuldebate.com really was still available, last time I looked. I strongly suspect it would be a magnet for offensive comments though…
#90 by Jeffrey on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 12:58 pm
1. So what is Kit’s intent to have this (political) blog? In part, I would surmise, to allow interaction between readers and exchange views/ information, analysis of current poltical issues. Kit may also be able to glean some points here and there for political battle for wider PR’s Cause.
2. I would imagine that disagreement and differences of viewpoints is healthy and make this blog more interesting. I would think that deepening the discourse by dose of formal logic is OK and even preferable (by my personal view) though it may rub others the wrong way, as most would leave comments here based on impromptu impressions – which is part of the fun – without subjecting their comments to indepth discipline of the formalism of logic. At the same time, I can understand, no one relishes the idea of being corrected incessantly when their first approach at comment is not dictated by overarching desire to conform to the rigourous standards of logical arguments as they would otherwise apply in a thesis. That takes care of the animus part of the personal attacks.
3. Having said that if your purpose is to contribute to the wider cause of discourse in reference to the objectives of 1. above, why would personal attacks by some readers/posters, which are regrettable, that personally as to thwart the objective in 1.? It is like being invited to the house(blog) which you go to out of respect for or hospitality of the Host but you’re leaving the party not because the Host is withdrawing his welcome but because you find in the course of conversations some guests have made unwarranted and insulting personal remarks of you heedless that they are others less vociferous who may be appreciative of your conversation.
4. So what is your ‘logic’ of “I will not come back to comment on this blog”? If you think that others’ strategy of repeated personal attacks and abuse is wrong, do you forsake the objective in 1. to reward the strategy that you think wrong by complying exactly to that which is unjustifiably intended?
5. As Godfather once commented, if I remember well, that the world is a rough place – and I may add – there’s as much disagreement as there is agreement, so everyone has to fight to stake what he believes in the face of attacks.
I think the rules of engagment, even in this forum, are simple: you can either maganimously brush aside personal attacks irrelevant to the blog thread as not dignifying your response OR retaliate in ways you know best or deem appropriate : the law of self defence applies in the ‘Gaza’ of this forum as it would, the Israelis, whom you said surely have the right to self defence in the face of Hamas’ intermittent and snide rocket and mortar attacks. Do the Israelis leave their land? As to who has the moral cause would depend on who, without reasonable cause, threw the first punch and drew first blood.
#91 by computation on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 12:58 pm
yes well unfortunately as well
if i am not wrong malays cannot rise
above the rank of colonel in the
army. their salaries can exceed the
bracket for the rank of colonel
but the rank itself cannot.
i am not sure on this though.
#92 by OrangRojak on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 1:12 pm
It’s a dog-eat-dog environment
You’ve been living in Malaysia too long! Where can I get some good dog, anyway? Or is it off the menu like bacon?
#93 by dawsheng on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 1:14 pm
“Your strategy of repeated personal attacks and abuse has worked. I will not come back to comment on this blog.”
Don’t be so sensitive. I read your comments seriously.
#94 by Jeffrey on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 1:15 pm
Go the Serdang (I think). They look like rabbits (after skinning) and taste like dog. :)
#95 by dawsheng on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 1:19 pm
“It’s a dog-eat-dog environment where the fittest survive and the unfit get trampled.” – Godfather
And resorting to personal attacks are part and parcel of surviving, I can understand that. Some people cannot just agree and disagree.
#96 by dawsheng on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 1:24 pm
We are not dealing with “ifs” and “buts”. – Godfather
That’s like a fairy tale.
#97 by Jeffrey on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 1:27 pm
I didn’t know (until just now) that this Blog/forum has become ‘a dog-eat-dog’ environment. I wonder what our host Kit has to say about his blog becoming one….So fellas, grow your fangs and lacerate your attacker, or if not, you can grow fat so as to make certain that the dog that eats you, itself dies of indigestion.
#98 by dawsheng on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 1:35 pm
“Yes as a Chinese, I will vote in PAS anytime, anywhere in this country, because with the Pakatan Rakyat I can rest assured that the law as spelled out in our constitution will reign supreme, and pretenders like PAS will be stopped right in their tracks by the DAP unlike the shenanigans at the MIC and MCA who have now brought minorities to their knees by deceiving them of their rights by colluding with UMNO.” – Jonathan Tan
And we live happily ever after? Can DAP stop PAS? Is this a joke?
#99 by undergrad2 on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 1:40 pm
Eating black dog in Malaysia is supposed to make you horny! My dog was not even black.
#100 by undergrad2 on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 1:48 pm
OrangRojak Says:
Today at 13: 12.45 (27 minutes ago)
It’s a dog-eat-dog environment
You’ve been living in Malaysia too long! Where can I get some good dog, anyway? Or is it off the menu like bacon?”
Not only do they eat dog, tiger pe*nis is sought after because it is supposed to keep you on edge for four hours.
#101 by TheWrathOfGrapes on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 1:49 pm
/// # cintanegara Says:
Today at 10: 58.33 (2 hours ago)
In Malaysia, every citizen enjoys equal opportunities. That’s why we have Pilots from the minority groups flying the fighter jets. It is not that we don’t have talented and capable people from the majority groups to fill up the posts. We trust every of our citizens and their loyalty to the nation…..Yes, Malaysia is a unique country.. ///
If you really trust the Chinese and Indians, they would probably fill up 99% of the fighter jets if all pilots compete on merit. You have a few non-Malay pilots for show. If non-Malays are given equal opportunity in the RMAF, then you won’t have hundreds of them flying as pilots for SIA and RSAF.
On the other hand, there are many Indian fighter pilots in the RSAF. Heck, some of them even made it to the elite Black Knights – the creme de la creme of the Air Force – the aerobatic team.
http://www.mindef.gov.sg/imindef/resources/videos/features/2008/feb.html
#102 by dawsheng on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 1:57 pm
The conclusion is Non-Muslims can now vote for PAS because DAP is there to stop them from implementing Hudud laws. Is that IT?
#103 by undergrad2 on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 1:59 pm
Godfather Says:
Today at 12: 33.55 (1 hour ago)
Oh dear ! I can’t speak for Undergrad2, but I should think that Cambridge trains its students for the challenges of the real world. The real world isn’t …”
I have a classmate who has a first from Cambridge but failed his bar exams more than four times and was barred from sitting again. I don’t know what happened to him after that.
#104 by cintanegara on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 2:03 pm
computation Says:
“yes well unfortunately as well
if i am not wrong malays cannot rise
above the rank of colonel in the
army. their salaries can exceed the
bracket for the rank of colonel
but the rank itself cannot.
i am not sure on this though.”
If what Computation says is true…What will DAP supporters say about this?
#105 by OrangRojak on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 2:03 pm
I must steer clear of tiger pen!s, falling off the edge into unconsciousness is my favourite bit. Four hours would be torture.
#106 by computation on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 2:07 pm
they will say
“shut up computation!”
:)
#107 by undergrad2 on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 2:10 pm
After four hours you’re supposed to see a nurse who would be too happy to give you the necessary injection. If you can’t afford it then rest assured that what goes up must come down.
#108 by undergrad2 on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 2:11 pm
…eventually.
#109 by OrangRojak on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 2:17 pm
That reminds me of the old joke about the salesman asking why the old folks’ home bought so many Viagra pills. The Head Nurse explained that she gave each patient one pill before bedtime to stop them rolling out of bed.
#110 by cto on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 3:21 pm
OrangRojak Says:
Today at 14: 17.50 (1 hour ago)
That reminds me of the old joke about the salesman asking why the old folks’ home bought so many Viagra pills. The Head Nurse explained that she gave each patient one pill before bedtime to stop them rolling out of bed.
——————————–
Have you heard about the case where Scotland Yard was looking for a gang of hardened criminals who stole the entire shipment of viagra?
#111 by TheWrathOfGrapes on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 3:23 pm
/// I think the rules of engagment, even in this forum, are simple: you can either maganimously brush aside personal attacks irrelevant to the blog thread as not dignifying your response OR retaliate in ways you know best or deem appropriate… ///
Jeffrey, I can subscribe to the above. However, the same culprit who sprout one-liners and puerile irrelevant snide remarks was the same one who went crying foul and appealing to Kit when he was attacked and shown up as the charlatan that he was and still is.
My teenage son wanted to know more about Gaza and the Palestinian problem, and I thought a good intro to this complex subject was the series of 3 articles on Gaza & the Liberal Conscience by Farish Noor. I gave him the url of this blog and guess what? The first question he asked me was – who’s this immature guy who never grew up and who kept posting silly remarks. He thinks this guy is a school yard bully who pretends to be an adult.
Instead of adding to the discourse, some of the comments are really subtracting and distracting.
I can give as good as any – but I have decided to be an observer and only contribute when I feel like it. But I have been following the antics of a certain recalcitrant – a half wit who thinks that he is witty.
But enough of this – a Happy and Prosperous Chinese New Year to one and all, especially to Kit.
#112 by OrangRojak on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 3:36 pm
hardened criminals hehehehe the old’uns are the gold’uns
You know they’ve finally managed to make a male contraceptive pill?
You just have to put it in your shoe and it makes you limp.
#113 by chengho on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 4:52 pm
I like the story of Gaza , Hamas fight with Fatah , Hosni Mubarak
closed the tunnel…
#114 by computation on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 4:58 pm
undergrad2 says
“I have a classmate who has a first from Cambridge but failed his bar exams more than four times and was barred from sitting again. I don’t know what happened to him after that.”
your friend at the end of his stint at cambridge was
probably only half baked and limkamput would have
easily chewed him up…
:)
#115 by ryan123 on Tuesday, 20 January 2009 - 5:38 pm
I have been following the blog for sometimes, but seldom make a comment.
It is regrettable that some of those here would launch personal attacks again and again after being challenged by other readers, in the attempts to make themselves to look more superior and to gain personal gratification.
And, it is personal attacks for months. Great jobs being done by you guys to chase off the readers.
#116 by Godfather on Wednesday, 21 January 2009 - 8:56 am
Like President Barack Hussein Obama said at his inauguration speech yesterday, we too have chosen hope over fear. To those who choose to instill fear in our midst, let me just say two words – good riddance.
#117 by alaneth on Wednesday, 21 January 2009 - 1:56 pm
DAP supports PAS in KT.
Will PAS support DAP if there is a by-election??
DAP celebrates the victory of PAS. Will it be so otherwise???