M’sia not secular state – what say Sabah, S’wak?


Malaysiakini
Jun 17, 2014

YOURSAY ‘Position of Sabah and S’wak, where there is no official religion, is clear.’

Malaysia not secular state, gov’t says

Aries46: The Federal Court has in no uncertain terms declared that we are a secular nation and this has been reaffirmed even in a High Court decision last month.

Even a layperson is aware that we are a constitutional monarchy and our constitution is based on secular and democratic principles under parliamentary supremacy.

Even Muslims are subject to the civil courts notwithstanding the fact that the Syariah Court has jurisdiction over their religious and customary family matters.

While the civil court may not have purview over matters related to the syariah court, the latter is also not empowered to trample on the constitutional rights and provisions under civil law that is legally binding and exclusive to non-Muslims, under the guise of conversion.

This is an injustice universally under any law, Islamic or otherwise.

Magnus: Hinduism, Christianity and Islam are strong enough in their true faith constitutions and true followers to withstand and survive their religious hypocrites, corrupt politicians, inquisitions/crusades/jihads, mad Ayatollahs, defenders of the faith and other nasty terrorists.

So I am sure that a secular Malaysia is also strong enough in the strength of its founding federal constitution and decent citizens to survive all the religious hypocrites, corrupt politicians and the awesome stupidity, nonsense and crassness unfortunately still running amok in the nation, courtesy of the 57-year of nauseating, stuck-in-the-rut incompetent non-governance delivered by treacherous and incompetent BN politicians like Minister in the PM’s Department Jamil Khir Baharom and countless others like him whom decent Malaysians misguidedly elected in trust to do a good paid job for them in public service and to wisely govern and safeguard their collective interests and the common good of their nation.

Fernz: Article 3(1) and 50.4 percent of the 30 million population in Malaysia being Muslim do not make the Federation an Islamic state.

Also, the subject of Islamic state was not raised in 1963 (when the Federation was formed). This is a political question and should be settled politically, not in court or by the king.

The position of Sabah and Sarawak, where there is no official religion, is clear. No Islamic state.

Adsertor: Malaysia is a secular country by the very virtue that Islam is not the official religion in the two largest states in the country – Sabah and Sarawak.

Jamil Khir should read the Sabah and Sarawak agreements. These agreements supersede the constitution in areas they covered. Besides there are articles in the constitution that ascertain the secularism of the country.

Cogito Ergo Sum: If we are not a secular state, then the federal constitution is not supreme law of the land. And if it is not, what is?

By his declaration Jamil Khir had made a fatal flaw and if not rectified by the cabinet, will cause a catastrophic breakdown in the day to day running of a democracy.

Will someone with common sense stand up and up do what is right?

Turvy: Could the learned YB also explain what this means in terms of the consequences his interpretation has on his government? Could he also explain what he means by the term secular, because this appears not to be obvious in any legal document.

I can say that this country is tropical and everyone would understand this. But he in his ministerial authority, wearing what appears to be a western, Christian-inspired suit, cannot fall back on any so obvious definition of secular. So instruct us please.

Or is this a means to scare us Muslims and non-Muslims alike? And he gets away without understanding what he is talking about? What is secular? And what is non-secular? And then, could he answer the question that was raised in relation to hudud?

Is his answer, now in present continuous tense, to be always present and continuous?

Asitis: So is Jamil Khir saying that Tunku Abdul Rahman, the founding father of this nation who was present when our constitution was being drafted, was wrong?

The Tunku made it very clear that Malaysia is a secular country. Whatever Jamil Khir said now is his own personal opinion, and a misinformed one at that.

David Dass: Insisting that Malaysia is a secular state is like waving a red flag.

Malaysians of all faiths are deeply spiritual. Islam is the religion of the Federation and Muslims are subject to Islamic personal law. So nothing is achieved by insisting that Malaysia is not an Islamic state.

That said, we have a written constitution which is declared as the supreme law of the federation. Our rights as citizens devolve from the constitution and Islamic law is not applicable to non-Muslims.

For hudud law to apply to Muslims, the constitution must be amended. To amend the constitution to allow hudud would be a mistake. Non-Malay politicians should educate themselves carefully on the implications of making such an amendment.

Pemerhati: A more apt and true label has been given to Umno-controlled Malaysia by knowledgeable foreign observers. It has been described as a false democracy or a dictatorship.

This is because Umno can get the courts to give any verdict it wants because no judge would want to jeopardise his career by refusing the order of PM Najib Razak and Umno.

From time to time, Umno plays this game of letting the people who oppose them win their case in the lower courts but then overturns the verdict at the higher courts.

If it is a minor case, they may even let the opposition win. This is to create an illusion to the public and the foreign investors that Malaysia is a democratic country where there is rule of law.

The advantage of creating such an illusion is that the foreign investors will bring in their money to invest which will be good for Umno as they can siphon some of it for themselves.

The other advantage is that the leaders in Umno do not become international pariahs like the dictators of North Korea and Syria.

Lim Chong Leong: We are a lawless country. No democracy, no constitution, no police, no courts. Anarchy.

The police chief refuses to abide by a court order, the PM says there is no need for High Court but go straight to Federal Court, the attorney-general needs to consult criminals and victims before taking action, AG’s orders to the seizure of bibles are said to be illegal not adhered to and he takes no action.

Now a minister interprets the constitution to his own bigoted liking. ‘Habislah’ (It’s the end), unless the true Muslims stand up.

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  1. #1 by pulau_sibu on Tuesday, 17 June 2014 - 3:51 pm

    Ajib is worse than Abdullah. The country has been turned in a chaos under him. All kinds of problems have been created and we may not be able to fix them with time.

    But his God father, the M, is still not forcing him to step down?

  2. #2 by good coolie on Tuesday, 17 June 2014 - 11:30 pm

    All Malaysians must learn a lesson from what is going on outside Malaysia as far as religious extremism is concerned.
    In Malaysia, we must isolate and eliminate, politically, all those people who are trying to undermine the Federal Constitution. Some of these people are religious extremists, others are vile political opportunists. The opportunists think that they can take over power using the Islamic state issue as a prop. They don’t know that undermining the Constitution is to no one’s advantage.
    We must guard against the call to chaos. Today, my neighbour may lose his Constitutional rights through questionable intepretations of the Constitution; tomorrow, you or your child will suffer.
    .

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