Who would have thought that the RM100 million spent last year to celebrate the 50th Merdeka anniversary celebrations proved to be so short-lived and ephemeral, making so little impact on the Malaysian psyche and nation-building process to unite all citizens with the common sentiment and vision that they are Malaysians first and Malays, Chinese, Indians, Kadazans, Ibans and Orang Asli second!
This is why one of the fundamental questions confronting Malaysians today is: –
Why not Barisan Nasional-Pakatan Rakyat talks instead of Umno-Pas talks if the top national priority is to save Malaysia from being a “failed state” and establish that on the eve of the 51st Merdeka anniversary, we are Malaysians first and Malays, Chinese, Indians, Kadazans, Ibans, Orang Asli second and not vice versa?
This is particularly pertinent as the great challenges of Malaysian nation-building today concerning justice, freedom, solidarity, integrity and progress can only be addressed in an effective and meaningful manner through BN-PR talks and not through Umno-Pas talks.
The proposal by the PAS spiritual leader Datuk Nik Abdul Aziz Nik Mat that the implementation of Islamic hudud and qisas laws, among other things, be the basis of Umno-PAS co-operation and even merger, has raised serious concerns.
It is not only against the well-known position of the DAP, running counter to the secular character of the founding national “social contract” and Merdeka Constitution publicly upheld by the first three Prime Ministers, but also contrary to the fundamental commitment of Pakatan Rakyat to uphold the rights and interests of all Malaysians, regardless of race and religion, as enshrined in the Constitution.
The foremost challenges facing Malaysia today is not one of race or religion but whether we can harness and mobilize the talents, resources and energies of all Malaysians as one dynamic, vigorous and progressive entity to stop the nation from becoming a failed state like Zimbabwe and Myanmar when half a century ago, we were the second most developed nation in Asia after Japan.
[ML has just emailed an article by former Bernama general manager, Ahmad Mustapha written last year on Lee Kuan Yew's 84th birthday on September 16, 2007 and why Malaysia has been left behind by Singapore in the past four decades. If Mustapha's warnings are not heeded, then there will be no way to check Malaysia's continued decline down the league of nations. Mustapha's article should be serious food for thought by all Malaysians.]
#1 by zak_hammaad on Thursday, 31 July 2008 - 11:03 pm
shadow, we don’t usually see things as they are, we see them as we are. Dividing politics between Muslims and non-Muslims in Malaysia is a guaranteed recipe for disaster. Do you want a full scale civil war to destroy society and country?
#2 by limkamput on Thursday, 31 July 2008 - 11:04 pm
Singapore democrats? who are they? you mean a few losers here and there? you mean PAP not democrates. They have election there you know.
#3 by limkamput on Thursday, 31 July 2008 - 11:09 pm
>> PAP has no problem reliquishing power if the people really don’t want them,
If you actually believe this, it shows the level of your prowess and limited reading horizon, zak
Huh reading horizon, what the heck is that? At least PAP is not a desperate as your tribal party. Totally rejected and still want to cling on to power. You have no shame, the whole of Wilayah Persekutuan KL has rejected UMNO and yet you still want to cling on to major post and run the city. Baloney. HAS IT ever occurred to you that your tribal party is now only supported rural population who are probably shut out of information and news.
#4 by limkamput on Thursday, 31 July 2008 - 11:13 pm
Dividing politics between Muslims and non-Muslims in Malaysia is a guaranteed recipe for disaster. Do you want a full scale civil war to destroy society and country? zak
May I know who are doing that other than the race supremacists and religious bigots? Are you one of them, zak? No need to pretend, we know who you are. Who want civil war, you? I have no doubt about that.
#5 by devilmaster on Thursday, 31 July 2008 - 11:18 pm
zak_hammaad Says:
Nope. You’re wrong there. PAP is very much different than Umno. PAP put Singapore on the world map. Umno also put Bolehland on the world map, but for the wrong reason.
#6 by limkamput on Thursday, 31 July 2008 - 11:19 pm
UMNO is very much like PAP in that they will do everything in their power to remain in power. zak
Frankly PAP is not my concern. Is it your concern? Right now, I only know UMNO will do everything in its power to remain in power and this is my concern. What about you, is it your concern, or you actually want to tell us that it is ok for UMNO to cling on to power because PAP will do the same thing as well? Look, my little finger is smarter than you.
#7 by limkamput on Thursday, 31 July 2008 - 11:24 pm
sorry repost, due to mistakes
>> PAP has no problem reliquishing power if the people really don’t want them,
If you actually believe this, it shows the level of your prowess and limited reading horizon, zak
Huh reading horizon, what the heck is that? At least PAP is not as desperate as your tribal party. Totally rejected and still want to cling on to power. You have no shame, the whole of Wilayah Persekutuan KL has rejected UMNO and yet you still want to cling on to the mayor post and run the city. Baloney. HAS IT ever occurred to you that your tribal party is now only supported by rural population who are probably shut out of information and news?
#8 by zak_hammaad on Thursday, 31 July 2008 - 11:58 pm
devilmaster, that is not the point; the point is about thirst for leadership and doing everything possible to retain that, even if it means playing dirty politics and scare-mongering.
limkamput Says:
Today at 23: 24.20 (28 minutes ago)
sorry repost, due to mistakes
>> PAP has no problem reliquishing power if the people really don’t want them,
If you actually believe this, it shows the level of your prowess and limited reading horizon, zak
>> Huh reading horizon, what the heck is that?
Reading: Do you ever pick up an book a read? Do you ever get out of your house and travel and see the ground realities? Do you have anything tangible to offer apart from we need to do this? What difference have you made in your immediate locality and region? What positive impact have you made on the neighbourhoods that you live in and around?
Be practical for once and get your head out of the theatrics you unassumingly indulge in.
>> At least PAP is not as desperate as your tribal party.
“MY” tribal party, I have yet to vote in any election :^)
You hate and envy assumes to much, perhaps this is why you make laughable mistakes and continue to misunderstand.
#9 by zak_hammaad on Friday, 1 August 2008 - 12:05 am
limkamput Says:
>> Singapore democrats? who are they? you mean a few losers here and there?
What you count as few, they count as many, what you count as losers, they think they can change the face of S’pore politics (just like PR in M’sia). Like I said before, governments generally have a fear of numbers and manipulate stats to justify their continual policy political repression, very much like BN.
#10 by katdog on Friday, 1 August 2008 - 12:27 am
limkamput i don’t think theres any need for you to defend PAP. PAP has successfully led Singapore, regarded as one of the Tiger’s of Asia, to where it is today. That achievement is recognized by everyone in the world except UMNO their many envious supporters. What PAP has achieved cannot be denied.
Contrast this to what Malaysia can show after 50 years. Losing out in almost every way to other countries. Malaysia even have to import in nurses from India today. Thailand gets more FDI then Malaysia consistently. Singapore, Korea is way ahead in every aspect imaginable. All courtesy of 50 years of BN, NEP and Ketuanan Melayu.
#11 by limkamput on Friday, 1 August 2008 - 12:33 am
Do you ever pick up an book a read? Do you ever get out of your house and travel and see the ground realities? Do you have anything tangible to offer apart from we need to do this? What difference have you made in your immediate locality and region? What positive impact have you made on the neighbourhoods that you live in and around? zak
Who is your favourite authors, name me two and tell me the titles you read. Quick, I am waiting.
Where is the furthest you have travelled? Have you been to all the continents of the world?
I have already told you earlier, you are not my headmaster or scout leader, why should I be accountable to you what I have done or not done. By the way, what about you, what your done, since you like to ask others alot?
#12 by Al-Hujraat_13 on Friday, 1 August 2008 - 4:43 am
boh-liao,
Let’s get REAL. It takes two to tango and no UNILATERAL views are deemed as acceptable to anybody. This is a facts. With the kind of statement that you have made; the racial politics of UMNO will always be valid!
“Ha, ha – LKS baru tahu what kind of bed fellow he has been sleeping with in the last few months!! Be careful, very careful indeed, not to be sodomised by the sleeping partner under the same blanket!!”
>> What kind of statement is this? The actions of a few people inside PAS certainly doesn’t reflect the position taken by the party. Most importantly, the party has make it’s clear stand on this matter! If PAS really want to “screwed” PR, they can do so in both Perak and Selangor with ease…
“There is no way Malaysia is moving ahead on a racial-blind path. It has been, is, and will be always Malays and hence Muslims first.”
>> Wake up! Get real! The issues are always UMNO first! Even then, those who really benefits from it is those UMNOPUTRA. Common UMNO members has nothing to gain. PAS is a majority malay “Muslims” party and they are treated as some kind of “pariah” or “lepers” by UMNO! Open your eyes and please dont ever be ignorance…
“BN is under the control of the racist party, Umno. The true natives of Sabah and Sarawak have been tricked to join Malaysia and now their treasures, wealth, and political power have been siphoned off into the hands of Umnoputras.”
>> Yes! And so do the willing partners in MCA, MIC, GERAKAN, SNAP etc… All are equally guilty! Dont leave them out of the equation.
“Singapore certainly has no regrets leaving Malaysia! 1965, S$1 = RM1; 2008, S$1 = almost RM2.40! And the funny thing is Malaysia has oil, palm oil, tin, rubber, etc.””
>> You are equally right and wrong at the same time. There is no denying that as a government, the PAP led S’pore governments are truly very successfull in managing the economics of their country. However, to say that all Singaporeans have no qualms about their country is also equally wrong. Tell that to the opposition parties in Singapore, and you may got your answer…
“But Singapore has got lots of Chinese so got otak whereas M’sia has lots of Malays so….”
>> Shame on you boh-liao! It seems that you are no difference from those bigots from UMNO! Both of you shares the same distorted views based on racial supremacy.
The only reason why our country is in the despicable state that it is now is is because of people like you, people like us who did nothing except never ending complaints at the comfort of your own home, safely hidden from at the back of your own computer! How many people here who really wants to make a difference? How many people here who really have the guts like Lim Guan Eng, or Tian Chua, or Sivarasa, or Abdul Malik Hussin, or Syed Husin Ali or the various other “nameless” detainees of the notorious ISA? All 25000 of them since 1960? Where are us when these people is captured and detained without trials?
I still remember the common answer of many non-bumis/non-muslims in the many previous elections prior to 2008. What is their common answer? Do I need to elaborate here? Most of us have been a willing partner in this government in one way or another. Our hands are tainted. So do the hands of our forefathers…
Until we stop bulshitting with one another, and started to do our part as a larger community, do not expect anything to change here in Malaysia…
#13 by Bigjoe on Friday, 1 August 2008 - 9:13 am
Zak_hammaad:
‘ secular ideology that DAP proposes is impossible for most Malays to stomach because it directly contradicts Islam’.
This is a question best answer by DAP senior members. Sdr Lim care to answer? I will put my two cents worth on it.
I agree that the Malay oppose the idea of secularity but I my view is that its populist not based on facts.
Firstly secularity does not contradict Islam otherwise why would all rich Muslims spend so much time and even migrate in droves to Western secular countries? There is big difference between absolute separation of religion and state as constitutionally pioneered by the United States and secularity. Most countries practise secularity without absolute separation of religion and state. So the idea that secularity cannot incorporate Islamic principles is wrong. It just can’t incorporate ALL of it absolutely which in reality is what most Malays have been practising ever since they adopted Islam and basically have in mind.
DAP has shown while it fights for the ideals of separation of religion and state HAVE NEVER STATED its for ABSOLUTE SEPARATION. this is because we are way too deep already in mixing religion and state and its just pointless to argue about absolute separation. For the record, PAP, the older brother/cousin/relative of DAP does not practise absolute separation of religion and state, it practises what it calls ‘managed separation of religion and state’.
#14 by kiss or kill on Friday, 1 August 2008 - 9:15 am
break a little bit.
can we interview muslim chinese in china and muslim indian in india…to say what they feel…then you can make wish judgement on malaysian politics scenario. if you can only talk…and talk…and only see your neighborhood…never do your own research..then you are only talk rubbish….
#15 by k1980 on Friday, 1 August 2008 - 9:47 am
Heheheeh.. I have dollahed you all for the past 5 years
http://sloone.files.wordpress.com/2008/07/walktogether.jpg?w=300&h=240
#16 by raverus on Friday, 1 August 2008 - 10:16 am
Answer: $
Do you think amno can survive without cronyism?
#17 by Al-Hujraat_13 on Friday, 1 August 2008 - 4:13 pm
Bro bigjoe,
Zak_hammaad is right when he says that:
‘ secular ideology that DAP proposes is impossible for most Malays to stomach because it directly contradicts Islam’.
I can actually agree with the statement as being a malay muslim myself, it directly relates to me. Although I do not consider myself as ultra-religious, my conscience is clear that one day I’ll be able to practice the teachings of Islam whole heartedly. There is absolutely no doubts about that!
You are misguide when you say:
(i) The “Malay opposed the idea of secularity based on populist and not based on facts”.
(ii) Secularity does not contradict Islam.
As a race, the “Malay” can choose to be whatever that they have wanted to be. That’s why you’ll see so many malays in the like of UMNO’s ultra-elite, those “punks” from the ranks of malay youth, those “mat & minah rempits”, those “bohsia’s”, those socialite’s who frequently goes to pubs, discos, bars etc… These malays doesn’t quite take Islam seriously and they themselves are sometimes are misguided about Islam. That’s why you can see a lot of “self-confessed” muslims asking for bribes, are corrupted to the core, racists and doing a lot of things which are a blatant contradictions to the teachings of Islam. However, I’m not condemning anybody. It’s a freedom of choice and it’s up to them to be whatever they’ve wanted to be…
However it is very much different for real “muslims”, who wants or hope to really practice Islam in it’s entirety. Muslims are not bound by race. Muslims are supposed to be as anybody in this world who confess to the teachings of Islam. How can these people accept Secularism when it is actually the opposite of Islam. Literally, Islam means “submission”. It is a “way of life” for a life long journey. A journey for oneself until the time we all die. Therefore, how can a muslim accept secularism when Islam is supposed to be a way of life?
About the so-called rich Muslims who spend so much time and even migrate in droves to Western secular countries, it’s all about a matter of preferences. Islam never forced anybody to confirm to it’s teachings. It’s up to the individual. Islam is also about practicality. It does not enforce itself on any country where the majority of peoples are not muslim. Neither does it cordoned the oppression of minority where the muslims are the majority (That’s why the very practice of UMNO here in Malaysia has nothing to do with Islam). That is why you’ll see temples are allowed to be built in Kelantan under PAS-led government. That is why all of the talks regarding racial issues with UMNO is very un-Islamic and shouldn’t be allowed to happened in the first place.
That’s also why I cant understand the “phobia” of DAP or any “non-muslims” in Malaysia who will jump to the merely words on anything islamic? Try to understand this. UMNO did what it did because it choose to be an “Ultra-Nationalist” malay party. Nothing to do with Islam. The word Islam comes later when UMNO is in a dilemma when the malay world is experiencing a revival in Islam. So as any political party, in order to become relevant it has to also associate itself with islam, albeit in a very suspicious manner.
#18 by undergrad2 on Friday, 1 August 2008 - 10:17 pm
Zak_hammaad asks readers on this blog:
Q1. “Do you ever pick up a book and read?”
Q2. “Do you ever get out of your house and travel …?”
I am here to report that we are all illiterate or semi-illiterate at best. If we could read at all, our reading skills, unlike yours, are limited to reciting nursery rhymes. As for travel, the furthest we have travelled has been as far as our own backyards to tend to our cows and goats – unlike you who has traveled the world, been there done that.
#19 by AhPek on Friday, 1 August 2008 - 10:41 pm
Secularism, as I understand it,is adoctrine of separation of state affairs from religious affairs.It simplymeans preventing any religion from controlling government or government institutions and exercising political power.It is officially neutral in matters of religion,neither supporting nor opposing any particular religious beliefs or practices.Precisely because of this, secularism offers the best protection to religions pratised by minority groups of any country.
Zak,how could secular idealogy be so inimical that Malays can’t stomach it because it directly contradicts Islam.How could that be since secularism is neutral
in religious matters,neither supporting nor opposing any particular religious beliefs and practices, unless of course you tell me that Islam’s objective is to make any state they are in Islamic and replace existing laws by installing syariah laws.If you say it is then I can begin to understand the fundamental problem afflicting our world today.
As far as I know you would not find objections from other religions like Hinduism,Buddhism, Christianity,Taoism in embracing secularism because inherent in its practice is a sense of fair play.
#20 by Bigjoe on Saturday, 2 August 2008 - 10:04 am
Secularism by definition means ‘off this world’. Basically the system of government must be based on human reason above all else and divinity is not a begining of everything which is theological. Check your definition and understandings. Most Malay if you ask them if secularism is ungodly, agree which just goes to show their idea of secularism among them is not based on facts. Just because Secularism means human reason is to be used, its up to us to chose how much divinity we want when human reason fails. The US has took a stand of never, its not necesarily so although its 240 year experiment has proven to be very interesting and powerful.
#21 by shadow on Saturday, 2 August 2008 - 9:21 pm
Zak for your eyes only:
PAS+UMNO= Party Islam Malaysia
DAP+PKR+MCA+MIC+GERAKAN+PPP and other small parties= PR
I want peace and not disaster and that we can definitely get in this beautiful country for years to come. We need only the right person to manage this country. You know what I mean.
#22 by pjboy on Saturday, 2 August 2008 - 11:49 pm
Should this be the case:
Chinese tax-payers pay into a Chinese-only fund.
Malay tax-payers pay into a Malay-only fund.
Indian tax-payers pay into an Indian-only fund.
Each race will determine how the tax-$ to be spent.
so on & so forth.
#23 by sirrganass on Saturday, 30 August 2008 - 2:14 pm
I was trying to understand why so suddenly the issue of “PAS talk to UMNO” covers this page again. Anything happened recently that PAS is caught talking to UMNO again? I thought that issue was over and PAS has reiterated many times here and there that PAS will stick to PR and won’t pack with UMNO.
OIC, the real messege by LKS above is not about that, but it is on LKS’s indication of his deep worry about PAS’s policy of implementing HUDUD/QISAS (whether together with UMNO or independently).
A good number of comments here are indicating that PAS should leave PR. For good? It is not ok for PAS to be in PR and implement hudud for muslim s(only for muslim)? Is is really better to require PAS to leave PR and implement Hudud with UMNO instead? Are you sure?
DAP wants the Malaysian Malaysia (Still a racial issue). But PAS wants HUDUD for MUSLIM – Muslim ONLY – this is not a racial issue. And still you saying PAS is THAT BAD?
Will “HUDUD for MUSLIM” spoil your “Malaysian Malaysia” agenda?
Do you actually wish to say that there shouldn’t be any Pas’s Syariah/Hudud Law (only for Muslim) in Malaysia? Syariah Court must be replaced with DAP’s Secular Law? Is it like that?
Be careful, friends! UMNO is your “enemy”. and PAS seems to be your enemy too? Then…. how? Go back to UMNO, right?