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	<title>Comments on: Goodwill ex gratia payments to Anwar, Guan Eng, Syed Ahmad Idid and Operation Lalang ISA detainees?</title>
	<atom:link href="http://blog.limkitsiang.com/2008/04/19/goodwill-ex-gratia-payments-to-anwar-guan-eng-syed-ahmad-idid-and-operation-lalang-isa-detainees/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://blog.limkitsiang.com/2008/04/19/goodwill-ex-gratia-payments-to-anwar-guan-eng-syed-ahmad-idid-and-operation-lalang-isa-detainees/</link>
	<description>for Malaysia</description>
	<pubDate>Thu, 20 Nov 2008 10:41:05 +0000</pubDate>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=2.6.3</generator>
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		<title>By: lakilompat</title>
		<link>http://blog.limkitsiang.com/2008/04/19/goodwill-ex-gratia-payments-to-anwar-guan-eng-syed-ahmad-idid-and-operation-lalang-isa-detainees/#comment-99502</link>
		<dc:creator>lakilompat</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Apr 2008 01:04:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.limkitsiang.com/2008/04/19/goodwill-ex-gratia-payments-to-anwar-guan-eng-syed-ahmad-idid-and-operation-lalang-isa-detainees/#comment-99502</guid>
		<description>I think AAB is a brave man not even Tun Dr. Mahathir can compare, he is not afraid of his "face" as much as Tun Dr. Mahathir.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think AAB is a brave man not even Tun Dr. Mahathir can compare, he is not afraid of his &#8220;face&#8221; as much as Tun Dr. Mahathir.</p>
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		<title>By: ktteokt</title>
		<link>http://blog.limkitsiang.com/2008/04/19/goodwill-ex-gratia-payments-to-anwar-guan-eng-syed-ahmad-idid-and-operation-lalang-isa-detainees/#comment-99422</link>
		<dc:creator>ktteokt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 12:39:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.limkitsiang.com/2008/04/19/goodwill-ex-gratia-payments-to-anwar-guan-eng-syed-ahmad-idid-and-operation-lalang-isa-detainees/#comment-99422</guid>
		<description>Perhaps AAB is so generous, he may decide to offer the other side of his face to be slapped!!!!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Perhaps AAB is so generous, he may decide to offer the other side of his face to be slapped!!!!</p>
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		<title>By: lakilompat</title>
		<link>http://blog.limkitsiang.com/2008/04/19/goodwill-ex-gratia-payments-to-anwar-guan-eng-syed-ahmad-idid-and-operation-lalang-isa-detainees/#comment-99375</link>
		<dc:creator>lakilompat</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 09:10:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.limkitsiang.com/2008/04/19/goodwill-ex-gratia-payments-to-anwar-guan-eng-syed-ahmad-idid-and-operation-lalang-isa-detainees/#comment-99375</guid>
		<description>They are treating the judges like beggars, just give the money without apologizing their past mistakes.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>They are treating the judges like beggars, just give the money without apologizing their past mistakes.</p>
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		<title>By: seage</title>
		<link>http://blog.limkitsiang.com/2008/04/19/goodwill-ex-gratia-payments-to-anwar-guan-eng-syed-ahmad-idid-and-operation-lalang-isa-detainees/#comment-99257</link>
		<dc:creator>seage</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 00:40:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.limkitsiang.com/2008/04/19/goodwill-ex-gratia-payments-to-anwar-guan-eng-syed-ahmad-idid-and-operation-lalang-isa-detainees/#comment-99257</guid>
		<description>It is amusing to read some of the comments around here crying "foul play" or "unfair" when the government used the tax payers monies to pay to these 6 judges or for that instance any other so-called mega project (more like mega 'korek'). The fact is, the Rakyat makes mistakes too and should bear the outcome of their mistakes. 

The "Mother-of -all-mistakes" is to give your vote to BN and continuing to do so for the pass few GEs (Hopefully non of you for GE12 and more so GE13). Your votes becomes the government! It is fortunate that plenty changed their stand after much enlightenment through the rich and advance technology available to us today i.e. internet. I am guilty for believing in BN for the pass few GEs but am glad that I no longer trust in them. I am paying for my previous folly and still am now...until PR finally took over as the fed gov (fingers crossed).

No doubt Ex-gratia is the lousiest form of remedy, it is something that you can expect from the current gov. 

Ex Gratia payment = RM50m 
Dinner for the event = RM100k
Remedial action to the judicial system = Priceless

B.Ann is too blind to see that only things that no price can be attached to is priceless!

While tax payers are still being penalised for their wrong decision, lets hope that such a predicament will end in GE13! To have PR as the fed gov... priceless!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It is amusing to read some of the comments around here crying &#8220;foul play&#8221; or &#8220;unfair&#8221; when the government used the tax payers monies to pay to these 6 judges or for that instance any other so-called mega project (more like mega &#8216;korek&#8217;). The fact is, the Rakyat makes mistakes too and should bear the outcome of their mistakes. </p>
<p>The &#8220;Mother-of -all-mistakes&#8221; is to give your vote to BN and continuing to do so for the pass few GEs (Hopefully non of you for GE12 and more so GE13). Your votes becomes the government! It is fortunate that plenty changed their stand after much enlightenment through the rich and advance technology available to us today i.e. internet. I am guilty for believing in BN for the pass few GEs but am glad that I no longer trust in them. I am paying for my previous folly and still am now&#8230;until PR finally took over as the fed gov (fingers crossed).</p>
<p>No doubt Ex-gratia is the lousiest form of remedy, it is something that you can expect from the current gov. </p>
<p>Ex Gratia payment = RM50m<br />
Dinner for the event = RM100k<br />
Remedial action to the judicial system = Priceless</p>
<p>B.Ann is too blind to see that only things that no price can be attached to is priceless!</p>
<p>While tax payers are still being penalised for their wrong decision, lets hope that such a predicament will end in GE13! To have PR as the fed gov&#8230; priceless!</p>
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		<title>By: ktteokt</title>
		<link>http://blog.limkitsiang.com/2008/04/19/goodwill-ex-gratia-payments-to-anwar-guan-eng-syed-ahmad-idid-and-operation-lalang-isa-detainees/#comment-99254</link>
		<dc:creator>ktteokt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 20 Apr 2008 23:44:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.limkitsiang.com/2008/04/19/goodwill-ex-gratia-payments-to-anwar-guan-eng-syed-ahmad-idid-and-operation-lalang-isa-detainees/#comment-99254</guid>
		<description>The ex-gratia payment is one slap on the face of AAB who dares to turn around and tell the rakyat, "It's okay, it's not painful!"</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The ex-gratia payment is one slap on the face of AAB who dares to turn around and tell the rakyat, &#8220;It&#8217;s okay, it&#8217;s not painful!&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: HJ Angus</title>
		<link>http://blog.limkitsiang.com/2008/04/19/goodwill-ex-gratia-payments-to-anwar-guan-eng-syed-ahmad-idid-and-operation-lalang-isa-detainees/#comment-99130</link>
		<dc:creator>HJ Angus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 20 Apr 2008 02:57:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.limkitsiang.com/2008/04/19/goodwill-ex-gratia-payments-to-anwar-guan-eng-syed-ahmad-idid-and-operation-lalang-isa-detainees/#comment-99130</guid>
		<description>It is helpful to remind ourselves that our nation is called Malaysia and not UTOPIA where everything works to perfection.

I am sure that the justice demanded by many here will happen if/when the Opposition rules but that is still a work in progress.

Now there is also talk for an independent ACA but I suggest we should remind them of the IPCMC first.
http://malaysiawatch3.blogspot.com/2008/04/independent-aca-would-be-great-but-lets.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It is helpful to remind ourselves that our nation is called Malaysia and not UTOPIA where everything works to perfection.</p>
<p>I am sure that the justice demanded by many here will happen if/when the Opposition rules but that is still a work in progress.</p>
<p>Now there is also talk for an independent ACA but I suggest we should remind them of the IPCMC first.<br />
<a href="http://malaysiawatch3.blogspot.com/2008/04/independent-aca-would-be-great-but-lets.html" rel="nofollow">http://malaysiawatch3.blogspot.com/2008/04/independent-aca-would-be-great-but-lets.html</a></p>
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		<title>By: ktteokt</title>
		<link>http://blog.limkitsiang.com/2008/04/19/goodwill-ex-gratia-payments-to-anwar-guan-eng-syed-ahmad-idid-and-operation-lalang-isa-detainees/#comment-99124</link>
		<dc:creator>ktteokt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 20 Apr 2008 02:15:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.limkitsiang.com/2008/04/19/goodwill-ex-gratia-payments-to-anwar-guan-eng-syed-ahmad-idid-and-operation-lalang-isa-detainees/#comment-99124</guid>
		<description>It makes me wonder what the purpose of hanging up the four large banners in front of the Courts Complex in Jalan Duta with the words "BUAT KERJA" really mean. Does it mean only now the Court staff will start to work? Have they been sleeping all these while? Or does it mean they are only going to work seriously from now on? Any one of these reasons will only prove the people housed within this complex as being "incompetent" prior to the March 8 political tsunami. This amounts to a self-confession of incompetency from the top-most judges, registrars, judicial commissioners, magistrates, court staff right up to office boys.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It makes me wonder what the purpose of hanging up the four large banners in front of the Courts Complex in Jalan Duta with the words &#8220;BUAT KERJA&#8221; really mean. Does it mean only now the Court staff will start to work? Have they been sleeping all these while? Or does it mean they are only going to work seriously from now on? Any one of these reasons will only prove the people housed within this complex as being &#8220;incompetent&#8221; prior to the March 8 political tsunami. This amounts to a self-confession of incompetency from the top-most judges, registrars, judicial commissioners, magistrates, court staff right up to office boys.</p>
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		<title>By: Godfather</title>
		<link>http://blog.limkitsiang.com/2008/04/19/goodwill-ex-gratia-payments-to-anwar-guan-eng-syed-ahmad-idid-and-operation-lalang-isa-detainees/#comment-99121</link>
		<dc:creator>Godfather</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 20 Apr 2008 01:43:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.limkitsiang.com/2008/04/19/goodwill-ex-gratia-payments-to-anwar-guan-eng-syed-ahmad-idid-and-operation-lalang-isa-detainees/#comment-99121</guid>
		<description>World class judiciary ?  More like a world class con job.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>World class judiciary ?  More like a world class con job.</p>
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		<title>By: Bigjoe</title>
		<link>http://blog.limkitsiang.com/2008/04/19/goodwill-ex-gratia-payments-to-anwar-guan-eng-syed-ahmad-idid-and-operation-lalang-isa-detainees/#comment-99119</link>
		<dc:creator>Bigjoe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 20 Apr 2008 01:39:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.limkitsiang.com/2008/04/19/goodwill-ex-gratia-payments-to-anwar-guan-eng-syed-ahmad-idid-and-operation-lalang-isa-detainees/#comment-99119</guid>
		<description>The whole point of an ex-gratia payment in lieu of a full apology is there is no admission of guilt that can be used as a basis for any other case. Sure its a cop-out, but do we really think suddently this PM has changed his stripes completely?

The issue to me is this: IF the goal of this and subsequent administration is to build a world class judiciary, can it avoid paying for the consequences of the injustices and damages done forever?

There is such a thing as a statute of limitation in law but NOT when it comes to non-financial damages. A world class judiciary cannot avoid looking at the consequences and damages even 50 or 100 years after the incidence so long as locus standi can be proven. So even if aggrieved party such as Sdr. Lim may not be around one day, so long as his sons and grandchildren keep asking for damages, sooner or later a world class court have to hear them.

This to me is the biggest danger of the NEP, its clearly unconstitutional now if you are a strict constitutionalist as it violates Article 8. If its not removed, someday when we do have a decent court system, big group(s) of Indians and Chinese will put together the mother of all class-action suits that our government cannot afford.

Sdr. Lim suggestion is correct but its about paying for the consequences of wrong under Dr. M now rather than later where it could be even worst.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The whole point of an ex-gratia payment in lieu of a full apology is there is no admission of guilt that can be used as a basis for any other case. Sure its a cop-out, but do we really think suddently this PM has changed his stripes completely?</p>
<p>The issue to me is this: IF the goal of this and subsequent administration is to build a world class judiciary, can it avoid paying for the consequences of the injustices and damages done forever?</p>
<p>There is such a thing as a statute of limitation in law but NOT when it comes to non-financial damages. A world class judiciary cannot avoid looking at the consequences and damages even 50 or 100 years after the incidence so long as locus standi can be proven. So even if aggrieved party such as Sdr. Lim may not be around one day, so long as his sons and grandchildren keep asking for damages, sooner or later a world class court have to hear them.</p>
<p>This to me is the biggest danger of the NEP, its clearly unconstitutional now if you are a strict constitutionalist as it violates Article 8. If its not removed, someday when we do have a decent court system, big group(s) of Indians and Chinese will put together the mother of all class-action suits that our government cannot afford.</p>
<p>Sdr. Lim suggestion is correct but its about paying for the consequences of wrong under Dr. M now rather than later where it could be even worst.</p>
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