Sin Chew Daily today reported that Parliament would be dissolved on the eighth day of the Chinese New Year (i.e. 14th February 2008), with Nomination Day immediately after Chap Goh Mei (21st February) and polling on 2nd or 3rd March, 2008.
The probability of the next general election falling in the first weekend of March is very high, which would mean that a new Parliament could be elected within 40 days!
Earlier, speculation of the next general election focused primarily on March 15 or the weekend before it. However the option of March 15 for the next general election will have to be ruled out if the Prime Minister, Datuk Seri Abdullah Ahmad Badawi is serious about his announcement in Spain last week for the First Alliance of Civilisations Annual Forum that he would be in Senegal in March to hand over the chairmanship of the Organisation of the Islamic Conference (OIC). This is because the OIC Summit is fixed for March 13-14, 2008 for Dakar, Senegal.
With the 12th general election falling right smack during the Chinese New Year, all political parties, leaders and members will have very little time to celebrate Chinese New Year this year, which begins in a fortnight’s time.
I am very disappointed that there had been agonizingly little progress in the DAP-PKR talks for an electoral understanding to ensure a one-to-one contest with the Barisan Nasional, avoiding three-cornered fights which can only benefit the Barisan Nasional in the past two weeks.
Both parties had reached an electoral understanding on January 7, 2008 on the allocation of parliamentary and state assembly seats in Penang, which was announced in a joint media conference by leaders from both parties in Penang on 9th January 2008.
Leaders of both parties had hoped that the Penang agreement would act as a catalyst for the speedy conclusion of seats negotiations for all states in the country so that all energies and resources could be focused single-mindedly in cutting down the Barisan Nasional behemoth with its 91% parliamentary majority down to size in the next general election.
But this has not been the case, as precious little progress had been achieved in the other states in the past two weeks since the Penang agreement apart from Negri Sembilan.
Even for Negri Sembilan, where the state DAP and PKR announced agreement yesterday to take on the Barisan Nasional in straight fights, the announcement was only confined to the state assembly seats although agreement had earlier been reached by both state leaderships for parliamentary and state assembly contests as well. However, as a result of national PKR intervention, the announcement on DAP-PKR pact in Negri Sembilan was only confined to state assembly seats leaving the parliamentary seats unsettled.
I am particularly disappointed at the agonizingly slow progress in DAP-PKR seats negotiations for I had stuck my neck out to break the stalemate to ensure that the DAP-PKR electoral agreement for Penang was reached on January 7, although DAP was subsequently accused of compromising its position and yielding to PKR pressures.
Such accusation from Barisan Nasional parties and personalities are to be expected, but there are also PKR claims of this nature, like SMS which immediately made the rounds after the announcement of the DAP-PKR electoral understanding for Penang that it was achieved after public threats by a certain PKR leader.
Perak was meant to be the next state for an electoral agreement to be reached after Penang but the differences between the two state parties seem to be as wide as ever, with even the PKR National Vice President publicly reiterating PKR interest to contest in Ipoh Timur parliamentary seat.
I find such lack of progress most disappointing. By now, all parties should be making their final plans for the general election battle which will be over in 40 days – and not still bogged down by seats negotiations.
For instance, PKR should be helping the DAP in its plans to wrest another three parliamentary seats from the Barisan Nasional in Perak namely Bruas, Taiping and Teluk Intan instead of publicly laying claim to these and other seats which are the focus of DAP efforts in the coming general election, including Ipoh Timur.
Let me try to resolve the DAP-PKR logjam in the electoral talks in Perak. If Perak PKR leaders are so insistent in wanting to contest in Ipoh Timur, let there be an agreement where a three-cornered fight is allowed for Ipoh Timur involving DAP: and PKR provided full agreement on a one-to-one fight against the Barisan Nasional for all other parliamentary and state assembly seats is immediately reached for Perak.
There is no more time to lose. I will go one step further and call for full conclusion of the DAP-PKR talks on electoral agreement for all states by the end of January, i.e. in a week’s time.
If general election is held by the first weekend of March, there are only some 30 days left to fight the 12th general election.
Let 31st January 2008 be the deadline for the conclusion of the electoral talks between DAP and PKR. I hope both parties can reach an electoral understanding for a one-to-one contest against the Barisan Nasional in the forthcoming general election, but if we cannot reach agreement, then let this be decided and known instead of dragging it out indefinitely, which will not serve the cause of cutting the Barisan Nasional behemoth down to size in the 12th general election.
#1 by dawsheng on Friday, 25 January 2008 - 1:22 pm
Malaysia is a secular state and political party based on religious principal has no room to flourish in multi-racial and multi-religious country like Malaysia.
#2 by Godfather on Friday, 25 January 2008 - 1:23 pm
That is why the DAP will fail.
#3 by Godfather on Friday, 25 January 2008 - 1:26 pm
With such mindsets, the Opposition does not have a chance, and we are back to where we have been in the last 50 years – barking at injustices, barking at the daylight robberies, barking at the constitutional changes that erode our rights. Carry on barking. My family and I will just spoil our votes as a sign of protest at BN policies.
#4 by Loh on Friday, 25 January 2008 - 1:51 pm
///Once ensconced in power, it will use its dominant position in government to systematically eliminate all values inconsistent with what to them is purist Islam – values of pluralism and liberalism of the West, liberal democracy, gender equality, separation of secular law from religious laws, separation of the sexes and so on until in the end only the Islamist ideological conception of Islam in its purest form prevails.///– Jeffrey
If PAS-led government behaves as is stated above, it will not last more than one term of office. The opposition parties of the day would stage a come back, and we do not expect them to compete on who could do worse to the citizens.
BN has shown that after 50 years, they have perfected the art of boiling frogs, and knowledgeable people on this blog would still want to continue with the old ways. The men on the street are now doubt more easily threatened with a possible recurrence of May 13, and would help to maintain BN in power.
#5 by dranony on Friday, 25 January 2008 - 2:18 pm
Godfather, why spoil your votes to protest BN?
Might as well give your votes to the Opposition, whichever party is against BN, in your constituency.
BN is too deeply entrenched, with too many beneficiaries, to be deposed.
The only thing that the rakyat (who are fed up with BN’s trampling over the sentiments and concerns of the rakyat), can do would be to just significantly decrease BN’s majority.
There is NO REAL possibility that BN will win less than 50% of the seats at this present GE.
Even if BN did (although this is a near impossibility, imho) win less than 50% of the seats, it can still form a coalition government by accepting some PKR, DAP or PAS winners into cabinet with it.
Of course, the BN’s monopoly and tremendous power (and with it, tremendous corruption) will be over.
THAT, is what we should aim for.
There is NO possibility that PAS will win enough seats to form the next government. EVEN more impossible would be the possibility that they have 2/3 to amend the constitution.
I think Jeffrey’s view and dawsheng’s view that a vote for PAS is selling your soul, is too simplistic.
We need to see the reality that PAS and DAP can never win enough seats to form the next government, even if jointly.
And EVEN IF DAP did win a huge number of seats, and BN falls short of ability to form a government on its own, DAP might rather join a BN led coalition (after extracting favorable conditions plus promises of better governance) than to join a PAS-led coalition.
#6 by sotong on Friday, 25 January 2008 - 2:27 pm
Strong support for religious party like PAS is the direct result of failure of the government to deliver justice and fairness.
#7 by ckloh on Friday, 25 January 2008 - 2:37 pm
Those who tell us that PAS is taboo are simply BN agents trying to “split†the Opposition vote to prevent the loss of their two-thirds majority.
Whilst I agree theoritically that DAP, PKR and PAS to cooperate in this election is the only way to deny BN 2/3 majority.
But practically, I think it is just easier said and done, and I eagerly hope that I proved wrong, so that we can outsted those coconuts from BN.
And to say those that are not voting PAS are agents/moles sent by BN are not true. The facts are many Chinese will deflect back to BN, if DAP and PAS jointly anounced a pact for this election. If those Chinese bloggers that are supposed to be more open to opinions and ideas are equally divided in supporting PAS, how about those senior Chinese citizens that are not internet literate, or those Chinese youngsters that are only interested in discos/hong kong pops or handphones?
We can argue until tomorow, those that not agree can make some experiments below.
1) Experiment 1
Location: Magnum/Pan Malaysia/Toto
Reason: There are alot of Chinese here especially of Saturdays and Sundays, enough to cause jems in various place.
Action: Just take a sampling of 10 person, and ask them two political question. This might difficult, most average Chinese will not be interested in political related matters.
Questions
A) Do you think those running in the govermnet are a bunch of crooks who destroy our nations?
You might get 70% say yes, if you are lucky.
B) If the answer is yes, are you willing to change it by voting PAS, but it means you need to give up buying 4D? It is all for the sake of the country, you know.
If anyone answer you yes, chances are he is not Chinese.
This is sad, but I think it is true. You might want to prove it, or you can proceed to Experiment 2.
2) Experiment 2
Location: Discos/Pubs on weekends
Reason: There are alot of Chinese youngster here especially of Fridays and Saturdays, enough to cause jems in various place.
Action: Just take a sampling of 10 person, and ask them two political question. This might difficult, most average Chinese will not be interested in political related matters.
Questions
A) Do you think those running in the govermnet are a bunch of crooks who destroy our nations?
You might get 70% say yes, if you are lucky.
B) If the answer is yes, are you willing to change it by voting PAS, but it means you need to give up liquor? It is all for the sake of the country, you know.
If anyone answer you yes, chances are he is not Chinese again.
Whilst I want to believe we can deny two third to BN if directly work with PAS, but I believe a lot of Chinese are not in the same boats. You can educate them, you can give them proofs, but to ask them to give up their personal interest, just for the sake of the country and deny BN two thirds, well I am not optimistic.
No point arguing, if you don’t agree please do the experiment above, and let us know the result. Seriously, I have tried with the sampling of 3 each, and all the 6 person agree that the government is corrupted, some angry but none of them interested to vote PAS, if this is the only way to deny BN two third.
Try it out.
#8 by Godfather on Friday, 25 January 2008 - 2:42 pm
I despair because the hardcore support for the DAP has always said “over my dead body” in any attempt to work with PAS. I despair because I can’t see the light at the end of the tunnel for future generations because this country is already on the slippery slope to oblivion and no one is brave enough to say “I am putting my chauvinistic principles aside for the sake of future generations”.
#9 by Godfather on Friday, 25 January 2008 - 2:49 pm
ckloh:
What sort of sampling were you doing ? Did PAS say that non-Muslims cannot have liquor or buy 4-D ? I can drink beer in Kelantan and Trengganu as openly as I could in KL. You can have bak kut teh in Kelantan, can’t you ? Your questions suggest to me that those were the exact fears that BN want to instill into the non-Muslim population. In fact BN has now gone a step further – threatening us with a repeat of May 13 and that threat came from the MCA !
#10 by dawsheng on Friday, 25 January 2008 - 2:56 pm
You see, the non-muslims in this case, the opposition’s supporters are not supporting PAS, they just want to use PAS to deny BN’s 2/3 majority but what is the consequences when denying BN’s 2/3 majority with PAS becoming a major political party? If I am PAS of course I will say please come and vote for me, I will help you deny BN’s 2/3 majority if that is what you want, but that’s about it that PAS will do for you. If we cannot deny BN’s 2/3 majority without PAS then so be it, I am not betting our freedom of religions and rights to freedom of expression as barganing chips.
#11 by sotong on Friday, 25 January 2008 - 3:02 pm
With PAS, race is not an issue…….but it is a huge issue with UMNO.
Politics of religion is most divisive and damaging.
#12 by ckloh on Friday, 25 January 2008 - 3:05 pm
Godfather,
You might be right or you might not be right, I don’t know for sure. But this is the perception that among my samplings, which are bunch of my Chinese colleagues and former classmates, to answer your questions.
It is all about perception, again I believe it is not that simple, vote PAS meaning no 4d and liquor, they can’t form the government, thus can’t change the law.
But this is the perception that they have. Sadly, accuracy of information is not decisive, but perception is.
To change perception now is little too late I afraid. And it is not easy too.
One might say, what can a MP of PAS do, can they change the law? One of my sampling told me that he believes as a MP he can not approve new application for 4D shops, for example. He is not going to risks it anymore. We all know how a headmasters that are pros Islam can do, don’t mention MP.
Again, accuracy of information is not really important, but the perception is. You can test out your own samplings, and let us know your finding. But this is mine.
#13 by Jeffrey on Friday, 25 January 2008 - 3:29 pm
First of all voting is a democratic right to which a person is entitled to vote according to his conscience and if that person does not want to vote for PAS on basis of “the enemy of an enemy is my friend even though he is actually an enemyâ€, it is his right to which you should respect than to label him either a simplistic “naive Chinese†or “simply BN agents trying to “split†the Opposition vote to prevent the loss of their two-thirds majorityâ€. The imputation is simply uncalled for.
Secondly, what’s so great about depriving BN 2/3 majority, when most of the material amendments requiring 2/3 majority detrimental to democratic interests have already been effected in the last 22 years of TDM regime? Also even if BN does not have 2/3 majority required to amend the law requiring (say) Islamic law to replace common law as general law in the country, do you have doubts that PAS will not align their votes with the BN to secure the necessary 2/3 to pass through such an amendment?
You may say what’s the difference if one does not support PAS, BN will have 2/3 anyway to pass such an amendment. There is however one difference : if you give your votes to PAS to make them stronger, it will only vindicate their thinking that mainstream support their theocratic agenda and encourage them to push harder for it. Case in point is when PAS won Terengganu, Hadi thought of implementing Hudud there in replacement of the Penal Code for Muslims; and PAS assumed a more tolerant face when it was trashed by mainstream Malaysia in the last general election where they did so bad that the Opposition Head post was taken away from Hadi. Also if PAS is stronger in Parliament it will only intensify UMNO’s race to further out-Islamise PAS to our collective detriment. And in that situation both side will be racing to intensify the Islamisation race with Non Malay/muslim support for PAS taken to be a token of their acceptance of Islamisation!
At the end of the day, one cannot still rid of the BN in spite of the downside costs. This is something even Godfather conceded when the basis by which he imputed naiveté unto some Chinese is shown in his question : “Tell me, how could PAS (or the DAP) by itself win an election ?†(in context of even if we give votes to PAS in certain circumstances).
This I must say is very contradictory to what he earlier posted at 03 19:25.
He said in that posting that “it is very clear that you are in the camp that will perpetually be barking dogs in an Opposition that the thieves know is simply toothless…Kit will continue to be NOTHING MORE THAN AN OPPOSITION LEADER, and the DAP perhaps will have 15 – 20 seats. Carry on barking. The thieves are going to have a field day stealing, and you guys can continue to have your bak kut teh and miniskirts plus moaning about how the country is going to the dogs under BN…â€
The context of that statement clearly means and is intended to mean by any reasonable who reads it that we should vote for PAS, in order for the Opposition (by inference a Malay based PAS dominated Opposition) to have a chance to kick BN out of power, and form a government on its own, something which I object because it would be a theocratic government.
And then Godfather turned around in his subsequent posting at 12.33.08 to say a diametrically opposite thing that the intention behind giving votes to PAS was more modest – not to facilitate its formation of a theocratic government but to deprive BN of its 2/3 majority, an argument I believe I have also given a suitable response above.
Godfather, I can only think in your favour that you are too blinded by hatred for the BN and the urgency to hit it at all costs, no matter what the costs to personal beliefs and conscience, to see with clarity the obvious aboutface shift in premises and flaws and fallacies of the position which you put forth for our consideration.
#14 by Godfather on Friday, 25 January 2008 - 3:44 pm
I have over the years consistently said that there is little or no chance for the Opposition to come to power. Neither the DAP nor PAS could assume federal power, nor both of them combined.
I don’t have hatred for the BN, contrary to what you think. I have hatred for injustice and theft – and I have consistently called UMNO as a den of thieves. What I have seen are policies designed by the ruling party to enrich themselves at the expense of the rakyat – and it is getting worse, not better with Big Ears at the helm. The latest of course is the bailout of Naza through the sale of a land building to Felda for hundreds of millions.
Unlike some of you, I don’t see voting for PAS as a sellout of our souls. I see the act of NOT voting for PAS as a sellout to the future of the country and to our future generations as there will be nothing left for them.
#15 by Jeffrey on Friday, 25 January 2008 - 3:49 pm
One would realise that depriving BN off the 2/3 will not by itself stop the stealing because they’re still the government. It takes a simple majority to form government. And except for selected areas by which 2/3 majority is required under constitution, they still carry majority votes in all other issues debated in Parliament. This simply means anyone who wants to stop the stealing will have to make the BN lose power and be replaced by an Opposition dominated by PAS. To use the 2/3 argument to stop the “stealing” does not hold water. If every non Malay votes for the DAP instead of MCA/MIC & Gerakan or PAS, it is equally possible for the BN to tone down some of its extreme policies if it requires the DAP to join its fold, though whether or not the DAP wants to do so is another issue.
#16 by Godfather on Friday, 25 January 2008 - 3:54 pm
No, it will not stop the stealing, but they will have to watch the excesses. They will not be able to amend laws under the disguise of “privatisation” of certain services in order to open up new avenues to steal.
What is likely to happen is that UMNO will implode when BN loses the 2/3rds majority, and so will MCA and Gerakan. OKT and KTK will be made scapegoats if their parties are routed by DAP and PKR. Badawi will also have to go. The hope is that whoever takes over these parties will offer greater transparency and accountability – which is really what we all want at the end of the day.
#17 by ckloh on Friday, 25 January 2008 - 4:07 pm
What is likely to happen is that UMNO will implode when BN loses the 2/3rds majority, and so will MCA and Gerakan. OKT and KTK will be made scapegoats if their parties are routed by DAP and PKR. Badawi will also have to go. The hope is that whoever takes over these parties will offer greater transparency and accountability – which is really what we all want at the end of the day.
Just thought this is too ideal to be true, this is bolehland we are talking about!
I can’t speculate something that haven’t happen, but look at what happen at FAM, how many results and trashings we need, in any country in the world, the president will just resign, and let others to rebuild.
We have failed and failed again, yet the leadership is not changed, and yet the president can says he is not coward, he will not quit and still can make alot of contributions. To the extents, some of the executive members of FAM requested the president to stay, as the country needs him.
Ok, now I speculate, if really BN denied 2/3 majority, I will expect some leaders will resign, and a few days later, they are back to theri jobs, due to the public/members outcry that we still needs their services. Some sandiwara for our enjoyment. Sounds familiar?
#18 by dranony on Friday, 25 January 2008 - 4:09 pm
The overly simplistic questions that are put to the Chinese voters by BN (ie MCA or Gerakan), in a UMNO vs PAS fight:
-”Would you vote for a BN government (even if corrupt, where many have to bribe to get things done), or would you vote for a islamic government where your religious rights will be curtailed?”
These overly simplistic views do not take into consideration that it is NOT necessary to have either ONLY a UMNO-dominated or PAS-dominated government.
They fail to see that there is a possibility of a weaker UMNO-led government, where there is a stronger Opposition to keep the BN in check.
The BN is only too happy to perpetuate this simplicity, simply because it keeps them in power.
I personally would like to see an election where the winners are (realistically achievable) 45%-65% BN, with the other 35%-55% shared between PAS, DAP and PKR.
In reality, BN will certainly be much more likely be 65%, than 45%, esp with the gerrymandering that has occurred.
Will PAS+DAP+PKR coalition form the next government EVEN IF together they garner 50%-55% of the seats?
Hardly likely, imho, as the DAP, if it can get 10%-20% of the seats, would be more likely to throw its hat in with a BN-led coalition, after suitably extracting favourable terms and promises of good governance from BN leaders.
I suspect that PKR might also do likewise, once DAP has done so.
Otherwise, a PAS-DAP coalition will likely be fractious, and will not survive long.
#19 by Jeffrey on Friday, 25 January 2008 - 4:21 pm
Loh said that “if PAS-led government behaves as is stated above, it will not last more than one term of office†– this assumes that you still have a democratic vote to do so. But you have seen how once a party like UMNO ensconced in power could do things. So the case with PAS. It could change the constitution to make sure ulamaks and clerics only govern and don’t be surprised that if it is in power, a lot of UMNO supporters may switch to join PAS to share power making PAS stronger and those against its agenda weaker.
I have mentioned before in my earlier posting – “I don’t accept at all your proposition that one is either with or against a PAS dominated Opposition in an the apocalyptic world of good versus evil, there being no neutral ground possible in the uncertain futureâ€, so what do I mean “ neutral ground possible in the uncertain future†?
Much of the dilemma is caused by an option between two alternatives – either BN in its present form or PAS.
Are there no other permutations granted that Malay majority votes are crucial supporting either of these 2?
Well I am not saying that this will definitely be feasible but it is possible to think about : what if, as it happened, majority of non Malay votes swing to DAP leaving MCA/MIC & Gerakan ? (Forget about PAS, its not in the equation).
Will it not be possible that UMNO (for the sake of showing pluralistic representation) may invite the DAP (that has made MCA/Gerakan/MIC irrelevant) to join the BN fold in their stead on grounds that both sides give in a little on their traditional agendas and platforms?
Isn’t this “ neutral ground possible in the uncertain future†as a tentative step forward in nation building in place of the other two undesirable options – either BN in its present form or PAS?
Assuming DAP joins under such conditions, will this not ameliorate or mitigate some of the excesses of UMNO/BN (so that BN becomes a different form) or are you going to say that DAP will be corrupted by joining? :)
#20 by Godfather on Friday, 25 January 2008 - 4:25 pm
DAP joining the den of thieves ? “One for you, one for me…one for you, one for me….” as the DAP and UMNO reps chant over the camp-fire…
#21 by Jeffrey on Friday, 25 January 2008 - 4:29 pm
It looks like what dranony said – “Hardly likely, imho, as the DAP, if it can get 10%-20% of the seats, would be more likely to throw its hat in with a BN-led coalition, after suitably extracting favourable terms and promises of good governance from BN leaders.
I suspect that PKR might also do likewise, once DAP has done so.
Otherwise, a PAS-DAP coalition will likely be fractious, and will not survive long” – is asymmetrical to the hypothetical scenario I last posted at 16: 21.33, as a possible permutation to that of either BN inthe present form or PAS (either of which is undesirable).
#22 by Jeffrey on Friday, 25 January 2008 - 5:01 pm
//DAP joining the den of thieves ? “One for you, one for me…one for you, one for me….†as the DAP and UMNO reps chant over the camp-fire…// (Godfather) simply puts an end to all arguments for change of government because if DAP – to whom generations of Malaysians are indebted for 30 years for championing civil and democratic rights – can “One for you, one for me” over the campfire once it share power with BN, how will it be any different when it shares it instead with PAS/PKR that you have been advocating everyone here to support their coming to power (in spite of the baggage of theocratic PAS)??? I would have thought you have more faith in the DAP than to say something negates everything else that you have been advocating all along. :)
#23 by limkamput on Friday, 25 January 2008 - 6:59 pm
Are there no other permutations granted that Malay majority votes are crucial supporting either of these 2? Jeffrey
Why either of these two? If non muslim votes can be split in the middle, why is there no such possibility of Malay votes going both ways? We need to make both Unmo dominated BN and Pas equally strong or equally weak, depending on how you look at it.
#24 by Godamn Singh on Friday, 25 January 2008 - 9:41 pm
What nonsense are you talking about??
#25 by Loh on Friday, 25 January 2008 - 10:27 pm
It might be true that PAS might remove democratic election within one term in office. After fifty years of the so-called parliamentary democracy, BN has slowly and surely remove the fact minus the form of democracy. When democracy is actually removed both in fact and in form, the people, both Malays and non-Malays would have a common objective in removing the dictatorial government. Yes, some UMNOputras could join PAS, but you will not expect all of them to do so. For those who remain, it would be less man more share. The honest among them may have the opportunity to rise to the position to lead the party away from its old self.
BN will never give up its time tested racist policies because the victims have conditioned themselves with the thought that things could be worse. Yes PAS could make our lives worse, but there might be a chance that they would make it better for all Malaysians. But with BN, we know that it would only make it worse for non-Malays for all to see, and to Malays too though not apparently.
It is not realistic to expect that PAS can come into power in the coming election. But we shall welcome it in the unforseen event, and be prepared for the worst while hope for the best; we have no hope under BN.
We must start by voting for opposition in the coming election, PAS included. It is hoped that MIC can be wiped out in the coming election. Without MIC, BN cannot claim that the race-based parties represented the interest of all communities in the government, and conveniently blames or praises Samy Vellu for supporting all the discriminatory racist policies of the government.
The only hope for the country is change. To change we need to support PAS.
#26 by waterfrontcoolie on Friday, 25 January 2008 - 11:41 pm
Let us look at one objective at a time. What is the 1st objective? Be realistic, the current combined opposition cannot topple BN. You only try to get 35%, so that they cannot do as they like. 2nd point, trace the history of the past polls, it would give an indicator as to which partner stands a beeter chance. Of course we have been talking about equitable respresentation of all Malaysian races. Can share that based on the overall percentages recorded? I do believe that in the ‘more’ urban area, the voters are expected to be better informed, hence should put on their thinking caps when voting. Show the ‘less progressive areas’ that we can transient the race factor!! We should be able to vote ALL those who are able to stand up and be counted come what may! By now, we should have an inkling of these people; if not, then MATI-LAH OPPOSITION! We might as well end all these discussions HERE!!!
#27 by Godfather on Saturday, 26 January 2008 - 12:40 am
Ask yourself these questions:
1. Are you better off now compared to 20 – 30 years ago?
2. Do the futures of your children and grandchildren look brighter or dimmer ?
[Clinton asked a variation of these questions when campaigning recently on behalf of Hillary.]
If your future, and the future of your children and grandchildren are likely to be dimmer, then you have no choice but to go for regime change. Don’t be like the Philippines where the point of no return was reached because the majority did nothing until it was too late.
#28 by limkamput on Saturday, 26 January 2008 - 12:43 am
The nonsense I am talking about, Mr. Godamn, is why must there only be two alternatives available to non Muslims, i.e. to either vote for UMNO (BN) or Pas? The non Malay can vote for both Pas and UMNO in order to split the Malays right in the middle. The problem with the non Malays is they will vote for opposition other than Pas. This results in Malays forming Government and non Malays in opposition. What I am saying is why can’t non Malays vote for Pas too. We must make both UMNO and Pas equally strong so that they are equally weak. Each of them will then have to depend on non Malays to form the government. Make ourselves the king makers rather than being scum recipients. Godamn, if simple stuff like this you can not understand, please don’t come here to insult me.
#29 by DarkHorse on Saturday, 26 January 2008 - 3:56 am
“Godamn, if simple stuff like this you can not understand, please don’t come here to insult me.” limkamput
He’s not insulting you!
He’s just expressing his disgust for a comment that makes no sense. May be he’s not doing that. I don’t know and I cannot speak for him – but I think he has a point.
#30 by Samson on Saturday, 26 January 2008 - 4:17 am
We have given too much power to BN over the years. Give BN another term who knows Malaysia will become an ISLAMIC STATE with no beer, bak-kut-teh and miniskirt allowed for the minorities of non-malays. MCA and MIC will as usual render themselves useless and spineless representatives of the minorities.
As at now under the BN government, we have seen how BN government has gradually increased the tax on beers and continuously attempted to make pig farming difficult and employed little napoleon to carry out the Islamisation processed to replace the wearing of “miniskirt” with the wearing of “tudung”. The demolishment of temples, the “body snatching”, the mushrooming of mosques and suraus are signs that Malaysia under BN is moving towards Islamisation. So what is the difference between PAS and BN?
I won’t be surprised that if this continue on PAS will sooner or later join force with BN and that’s the end of the non-malays.
Godfather and Loh are right. PAS may win small battles but they won’t win the war. I dare say between DAP and PAS, DAP will win more battles. There is no way Malaysia will be Islamised if PAS can only win small battles. But if BN wins, Malaysia will be an Islamic state as this is what our PM and DPM would like to portray to the delight of Muslim majority(or even to PAS) in Malaysia. The minority will continue to suffer.
What DAP should try to do is to garner as much support from the people by emphasizing and propagating on the unity among all BANGSA MALAYSIA(not races) and emphasizing on the eradication of poverty through the development and good administration of progressive Malaysia. I am sure there are Malays who truly love Malaysia would also like to see a better Malaysia in terms of unity of BANGSA and development of the country.
NO MORE RACE BASE POLITICS.
Limkamput is right in his comment. If we analyze we may have the equal support of Malay for PAS and PKR. Nevertheless our OBJECTIVE is to kick BN out and hope to see a better Malaysia.
Let’s have A BANGSA MALAYSIA for MALAYSIA
#31 by Godamn Singh on Saturday, 26 January 2008 - 6:36 am
There are Malays who are loathe to vote for the DAP, as there are Chinese who loathe to vote for PAS. That is not hard to understand. The problem is how do we get both Malays and Chinese who would vote for the opposition vote for the opposition regardless.
There are some here who have expressed their desire to stay away from the elections if DAP is not contesting in their constituencies. This is short sighted to say the least. Their choice not to exercise their constitutional right to vote could well give the election away to BN.
This is not rocket science.
#32 by Colonel on Saturday, 26 January 2008 - 7:28 am
“Give BN another term who knows Malaysia will become an ISLAMIC STATE with no beer, bak-kut-teh and miniskirt allowed for the minorities of non-malays.”
You can’t be serious! Even Kit does not believe this could happen. An Islamic state with 40% non-Muslims?? It’s not gonna happen! This is mere political rhetoric and we know it and they know it. The Malays and Muslims themselves know this. Are you saying the non-Malays are presently in fear of being made Muslims and have syariah law applied to them??
“I won’t be surprised that if this continue on PAS will sooner or later join force with BN and that’s the end of the non-malays.”
Isn’t hypocritical of you to be calling for an end to race based politics and yet advocate its relevance? You look upon BN as if it is a single party when it is a coalition of a number of parties Malay and non-Malay and Muslim and non-Muslim. The end of non-Malays?? Pandering is not the solution.
Crying wolf like what you’re doing here fortunately will not mislead those moderates among Malays and Chinese who still make up the majority of voters. The electorate is sufficiently informed and educated to know that the politics of race must give way to the politics of compromise as we approach election day.
The problem is how to convince voters unhappy with BN to come out to vote for the opposition, to turn their indifference or empathy into votes for the opposition, that BN is leading the country in the wrong direction and that it is time for the people to take back our streets and our government from a group of self-serving, corrupt Malay Islamo-fascists.
You make sweeping and contradictory statements which stand in the way of an electoral alliance between DAP, PKR and PAS – and Kit’s effort to forge a working electoral strategy. It is wishful thinking to say or imply that DAP can go it alone.
Not if it is serious in wanting to obliterate that overwhelming 2/3 majority control of our Parliament – which is key.
#33 by Colonel on Saturday, 26 January 2008 - 7:38 am
“What I am saying is why can’t non Malays vote for Pas too. ” limkamput
Yes, why can’t the Chinese or more specifically DAP supporters vote for PAS if that means voting for the Opposition against BN? Why must they so loathe the idea of voting for PAS simply because they disagree with their support for an Islamic state if that means giving their votes for the Opposition?
What is worrying is that there are some among us who hate PAS more than they support the Opposition.
#34 by Godamn Singh on Saturday, 26 January 2008 - 8:45 am
““What I am saying is why can’t non Malays vote for Pas too. †limkamput
This is Malinglish! Not Chinglish or Singlish. What do you mean by “PAS too”?
#35 by oknyua on Saturday, 26 January 2008 - 10:00 am
YB Lim, this must be a record posting where discussions spilled into the 4th day.
Godfather has a point about PAS. On Thursday I had lunch with a PAS member/supporter. Many things said about PAS are what we (in this case you) reads in the papers, mostly as part of UMNO divide-rule manoeuvre. I have consistently posted that in reality they are far different from what we perceive.
It is PAS’s manifesto to impose Islamic rules, BUT they are honest about it. They have declared their willingness to talk to non-Muslims about their rights once they are in power. On the other hand, UMNO had given forked-tongue announcements, saying what suits the audience. UMNO have nice words in front of you but unashamedly treats us differently a day after. How AAB treated Chong KK in Sabah and the treatment if Herald are the best examples still fresh in our heads.
The critical consideration: to support PAS and harbours hope for a change in government, or to ignore PAS and doomed to be toothless opposition for another 4 years. If the BN are made of self-restraining people, there is nothing to debate. But BN as we witness is increasingly blatant in ignoring all forms of good governance. In the MIC, MCA, Gerakan and UMNO, we see leaders as embodiment of crooks, liars, thieves, self glorifications etc. Indeed the BN is rightly still the Den of Thieves, but throughout the 2007, I could add BN is a: Den of Crooks, Den of Liars, Den of Hypocrites.
YB Lim, the concern expressed here may be a factor for DAP and PKR to speed up the pact. Personally I am not too much a fan of PKR. If you recall this party was set up for one particular purpose and since then changed their tune a few times. Yet for the sake of this nation, it is a necessity. Without a DAP candidate my vote would be for PKR.
#36 by khoo on Saturday, 26 January 2008 - 10:00 am
185 comments,I believed there will be more comming.That shows how important this topic.We need you to stand together and don’t repeat the 3-ways fight like in 2004 election.You have all the support of the people now more than ever.I personally believed you”the opposition” could do some damage on the BN.I plead to all opposition leaders,please sit down and talk all night if you need to but NO MORE 3 Ways fights.We are running out of time..Jom.
#37 by dranony on Saturday, 26 January 2008 - 10:11 am
I have been telling people I know:
“This coming election, if I had to choose between an UMNO candidate, and an underwear, I’d vote for the underwear.”
The problem though, is that if many voters are like me, and there are too many underwears to choose from, UMNO might still win! :(
Therefore, three corner fights where the opposition vote is split, should be avoided.
#38 by azam on Saturday, 26 January 2008 - 1:18 pm
Still some of you are very prejudist and suspicious.
Respect the other struggle and opinion is part of the civil society. Knowing and understand is very improtant. Thats why you need more dialog and drink tea togather with PAS member.
You mention that no beer in Kelantan. This is absolutely wrong. You can drink alcohol any time and any amount in Chinese restaurant in Kota Bharu or at your home. Nobody can stop you. Some of our brothers Thai people have home-made beer.
#39 by dawsheng on Saturday, 26 January 2008 - 1:29 pm
In PAS Kelantan, women was raped because they wore sexy clothes.
#40 by dawsheng on Saturday, 26 January 2008 - 1:31 pm
In an Islamic state, if your that “thing” stand when you saw gals wearing miniskirt, it is her fault you know.
#41 by limkamput on Saturday, 26 January 2008 - 1:51 pm
In PAS Kelantan, women was raped because they wore sexy clothes. dawsheng
You have always appeared to be someone mature and telling people, including me to behave. Please don’t insult Pas and Kelantan this much. Most of rapes are committed by wannabe lawyers who have one glass too many in the many pubs we have around PJ and KL.
#42 by dawsheng on Saturday, 26 January 2008 - 2:02 pm
Then it must be the beer and the miniskirt! You ask PAS supremo Hadi, he will tell you the same thing. If you think I am talking craps, wait till you hear what Sister in Islam have to say about PAS.
#43 by limkamput on Saturday, 26 January 2008 - 2:11 pm
Azam,
As a Chinese, I fully agree with you. We have a group of bigots here who can’t see their own prejudice and racism. They talked so eloquently about fairness and justice but if given a chance they will abuse their authority to the keel. They think they are here to give support to DAP, but in actual fact they have done great disservice to the party. They talked about democracy when they are the most authoritarian people I have come across. They talked about freedom of speech and opinion so long as they are in agreement with have half bake sense of right and wrong. The people I am referring to, in order of gravity are Dracula@darkhorse@colonel@Godamn@undergrad2. These are the bunkum baloney people.
#44 by dawsheng on Saturday, 26 January 2008 - 2:12 pm
“if you give your votes to PAS to make them stronger, it will only vindicate their thinking that mainstream support their theocratic agenda and encourage them to push harder for it.” Jeffrey
PAS is run by religious bigots!
#45 by limkamput on Saturday, 26 January 2008 - 2:18 pm
Their choice not to exercise their constitutional right to vote could well give the election away to BN. This is not rocket science. Godamn
Owah, so discerning ar!!! Cliché, chiche. You think rocket science very tough meh?
#46 by limkamput on Saturday, 26 January 2008 - 2:23 pm
He’s just expressing his disgust for a comment that makes no sense – but I think he has a point. darkorse
Sure, fair enough. You are now officially his standard, low.
#47 by Godfather on Saturday, 26 January 2008 - 3:32 pm
Dawsheng:
If PAS is run by religious bigots, how should we define those hardcore DAP supporters like yourself ? Patriots ? To which cause ?
When Trengganu was run by PAS, my friends who have businesses there told me that it was easy and predictable to renew licences, or apply for business expansion. Things went by the book. No duit kopi, no free shares. If you run a resort, you can sell as much alcohol as you want. When Trengganu reverted to BN, things reverted to the BN way – “how much do I get?”, “how fast do you want this?”, “who is actually behind your application?”….Look at Pulau Redang today under BN – resorts were approved and then built without environmental considerations. The biggest resort on the island dumped construction waste into the sea, reports were filed against it, but no action was taken.
The fears of 1999 are weighing heavily on the minds of the old DAP leadership, but the time has come for us to give the Opposition – any Opposition – a chance. Not to govern (because it is mathematically remote), but to keep a more diligent watch over the thieves that are constantly stealing from the national coffers. And if the Opposition doesn’t do its job properly, then we have to vote others in to replace them. Time to make our representatives work for us instead of stealing from us.
#48 by Godfather on Saturday, 26 January 2008 - 3:33 pm
Limkamput:
Stop this namecalling. I know the others are baiting you, but rise above it and comment constructively.
#49 by dawsheng on Saturday, 26 January 2008 - 3:56 pm
Just because I am against voting for PAS because it is run by religious bigots makes me a DAP hardcore supporter, therefore a democratic bigot?
#50 by Jeffrey on Saturday, 26 January 2008 - 5:22 pm
No duit kopi, no free shares in some cases yes but in other cases I too know of people/friends who had to pay to get their concessions/projects in Kelantan. So?